Glorious Revolution Jubilee - 1788

[maxmissy]

Can somebody help me ?
I have this token since a wile, but never found it on Internet : I just found a scalopped type, which is probably the authentic one ; I think this one is a restrike / copy ?
Sorry, I forgot : 24 mm - 4,7 gr

[Figleaf]

Certainly English in origin, it looks like the sort of commercial tokens sold cheaply in the streets during and after the Napoleonic wars. Such tokens were produced in whatever shape and size would sell best, so I would hesitate to call this a restrike. It is too easy to use existing dies on a different planchet.

However, there is another consideration. The glorious revolution resulted in more power for the English parliament and a confirmation of the domination of the church of England (in other words, a blow for absolutism and catholicism). These issues were still alive in 1788, through the political movement of Jacobitism. Sir Walter Scott, in the introduction to Waverley, acknowledges how even in his days, the issue was considered painful. The token could therefore have sold well in other times, to be worn as a covert political statement. Again, the makers would have had no problems producing anything that would sell at any time, so later strikes should not be ruled out.

Peter

[malj1]

It is listed in Dalton & Hamer's 18th century tokens as Middlesex 951.Bis [National Series] and described as on a halfpenny size flan, in copper.

Unfortunately no image is shown but it does show four similar varieties with the scalloped edge; No's 948 - 951. Two are signed Davies on the reverse while one has the signature as I.D

[Figleaf]

Good lead, Malcolm. DH Middlesex 951Bis is a different piece, though. DH describe it as obverse as 950, reverse as 949. The piece pictured in this thread is obverse and reverse as 948.

Number 948 is pictured at 27 mm in DH, while maxmissy measured his piece at 24 mm. I wonder if the scallops were shaved off to turn a 948 (described as "fairly common" by DH) into a 951Bis (rated RRR by DH.)

Peter

[malj1]

Yes it is as 948 but plain edge as you say.  Imagine it is unseen by D&H. [prior c1910] The series do not rate a mention in Seaby's token book.

...there are no sizes shown in my copy of D&H!

I shall have a look in Mitchiner later today.

[malj1]

Here is the information from Mitchiner - he too does not have this particular coin listed although the 6100 of his relates to D&H948 and is presumably badly cropped as he does say it scalloped.
The BHM catalogue might be of interest - I don't have this. IMO this coin would be as genuine as the rest!

[maxmissy]

Thank you all for all these informations
Maybe the scallops were shaved because I see some scratches on the edge ; they look as old as the token. Nevertheless, If it is the case, I do not understand why it should have been shaved ; certainly not to make the token rarest, because I bought it only a few euros in France some years ago.
Can somebody provide the weight of a scalloped version ?

[malj1]

Just checked - I do not have any of these.
See 6100 above which is same as yours but scalloped edge it measures 24mm weighs 4.25 gr. So slightly under weight of yours. But with scalloped edge would be slightly less than yours so I don't think you have cause to worry, its probably unlisted variety and no doubt there could be more. A search through auction catalogues may bring up more information.

I wrote that and then immediately thought of the Jim Noble collection auction; sure enough several varieties crop up there, see below.


Note all the sizes and weights are given above by Mitchiner.