Author Topic: Mughal Dynasty, Shah Jahan, Rupee (Crude style), Surat Mint  (Read 3165 times)

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Offline Overlord

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Identified using image of a similar coin at
http://www215.pair.com/sacoins/public_html/mughal/mughal_20_sha.html




A bit off topic, but any discussion on Shah Jahan seems incomplete without this:



« Last Edit: November 02, 2009, 03:21:11 AM by Overlord »

Offline Oesho

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Re: Mughal Dynasty, Shah Jahan, 1 Rupee, Surat Mint
« Reply #1 on: May 25, 2008, 12:30:29 AM »
The date is 1038 Hijri. I am not very satisfied with the fabric of this rupee. The legend is a bit clumsy. The art of die-cutting has reached its zenith during the time of Jahangir and Shah Jahan. The style of this rupee seems to be a contemporary counterfeit. Please compare it with a rupee illustrated on ZENO: http://www.zeno.ru/showphoto.php?photo=54402and you will see the difference in fabric.
« Last Edit: May 28, 2008, 11:49:04 PM by Oesho »

Offline Rangnath

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Re: Mughal Dynasty, Shah Jahan, 1 Rupee, Surat Mint
« Reply #2 on: May 28, 2008, 10:05:53 PM »
Thanks for the pics Overlord.  What a gravity defying wonder is the Taj!
Thanks for the link Oesho.  I looked at the coin on Zeno and at the one that Overlord posted.  In Overlord’s coin, the letters are a bit less elegant and certainly less rounded and subtle.  Just to clarify what you meant:  does the expression “contemporary counterfeit” refer to a copy rendered in the 17th century or more recently? 
richie

Offline Oesho

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Re: Mughal Dynasty, Shah Jahan, 1 Rupee, Surat Mint
« Reply #3 on: May 28, 2008, 11:53:26 PM »
Contemporary, means that it was made at the time the original rupee was struck. Counterfeiting is of all times, but the contemaprary produced coins were made to go with the other coins in circulation and not to fool collectors, that's is for most coins a much more recent problem.

Offline Overlord

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Re: Mughal Dynasty, Shah Jahan, 1 Rupee, Surat Mint
« Reply #4 on: May 31, 2008, 04:12:09 PM »
I don't know much about the minting process of these coins. My guess is that such fakes were made of an inferior metal such as copper and coated with silver (and were probably made with the help of some corrupt mint official). This coin doesn't have any test marks (nor does the beautiful set Richie posted about a couple of months back). Perhaps the presence (or absence) of test marks on these coins can also offers collectors a good clue regarding the coin's authenticity. Or did the counterfeiters manage to fake the test marks as well? Also, in those times, was one more likely to come across unmarked coins or those with test marks?

I have seen multiple test marks on some of these coins and often wondered why the additional marks were necessary. Was it done to verify whether the composition of the coin was indeed uniform?

Offline Rangnath

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Re: Mughal Dynasty, Shah Jahan, 1 Rupee, Surat Mint
« Reply #5 on: May 31, 2008, 06:33:48 PM »
I imagine that before a significant transaction (a wedding dowry?), samples of silver coins were tested to determine if they were good.  But the test, whether scoff marks or counterstamps, was reliable only for that one major event and issued by the individual contracted tester (jeweler, silver smith).  Another significant transaction would demand another sample of tests.  That is my theory and I'm standing by it until someone else offers a better one.  :P

Offline Overlord

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I finally checked the mass of this example today. It is 11.4 g.

Offline Overlord

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Re: Mughal Dynasty, Contemporary counterfeit of a Shah Jahan Rupee, Surat Mint
« Reply #7 on: November 01, 2009, 04:34:16 AM »
I checked out many images of this type online but didn't find anything that compared to the style of this coin, as Oesho had pointed out. Yet, the mass puzzles me. I would expect a contemporary counterfeit to be much lighter, as it would most likely be composed of base metal coated with a thin layer of silver. Could this be a modern fake then, made out of silver?

Offline Oesho

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Re: Mughal Dynasty, Contemporary counterfeit of a Shah Jahan Rupee, Surat Mint
« Reply #8 on: November 01, 2009, 04:06:30 PM »
No, it doesn't looks like a modern fake. It is only by comparison of the coin with other specimen of the same mint and date, that one becomes suspicious. The weight is correct. A trainee die engraver? Who knows atleast it remains a curious example.

Offline Overlord

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Re: Mughal Dynasty, Shah Jahan, Rupee (Crude style), Surat Mint
« Reply #9 on: November 02, 2009, 03:21:38 AM »
Thanks Oesho. I modified the title to read "crude style".

Offline Oesho

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Re: Mughal Dynasty, Shah Jahan, Rupee (Crude style), Surat Mint
« Reply #10 on: November 02, 2009, 12:25:53 PM »
I modified the title to read "crude style".
I can perfectly live with that description.