Do you think most coinages include a unit coin nowadays?

Started by <k>, June 29, 2023, 10:46:42 AM

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Do you think most coinages include a unit coin nowadays?

Yes
4 (66.7%)
No
1 (16.7%)
Don't know
1 (16.7%)

Total Members Voted: 6

Voting closed: July 14, 2023, 10:46:42 AM

<k>

Most coinages these days consist of units and subunits. In my country, the unit is the pound, and the subunit is the penny. 100 pence are equal to 1 pound. Other countries have dollars and cents, or whatever.

For a long time, the UK pound was a unit of such high value that it did not have a circulating coin. Over the years the currency was weakened by inflation, and in 1983 a 1 pound coin was issued in the UK. That was followed by a 2 pound coin in 1997. We do not currently have a circulating 5 pound coin.

Do most countries and territories issue circulating unit coins these days? What do you think? Vote in the poll above.
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<k>

I do not know the answer to my own question, because I have not done any research. However, my guess is "Yes".

I hope that this time other members will do the research and give us an answer. Numista is a good resource to use for this question.

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chrisild

Yes, I think so ... based on purely, ahem, anecdotal evidence. ;) Another question would be, does it have a "paper competitor", and if yes, what is actually used? Two examples: When I was young, Germany (the Fed. Rep.) had 5 DM as both a coin and a note, but the note was hardly used.

The other extreme could be the US where the $1 circulation coin was introduced relatively late, and since they never ceased making the corresponding bill, the coin is pretty much dead these days. So from a practical POV, the US does not really have such a "unit coin".

<k>

Quote from: chrisild on June 29, 2023, 12:28:48 PMAnother question would be, does it have a "paper competitor", and if yes, what is actually used? When I was young, Germany (the Fed. Rep.) had 5 DM as both a coin and a note, but the note was hardly used.

Yes, I remember them.

It could be the case that the Isle of Man and the Channel Islands still use pound notes alongside their pound coins, but I do not know. However, we have some knowledgeable forum members who may know.
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Figleaf

At the time that machine-struck coins, the pantograph and the collapse of, first the silver standard, then later the gold standard, came together, most countries used an inherited system of a gold unit, a silver unit and a bronze unit. Of these, the gold unit was replaced by banknotes, the silver unit by copper-nickel and the bronze unit eventually with cheap alloys.

In this process, the silver unit became the basic unit of account, with the bronze unit's value adjusted to serve as sub-unit in most countries. One of the few exceptions was Great Britain, where the gold unit became the unit of account. Nevertheless, in many (former) British colonies that used UK pounds, a silver unit (shilling or crown) became the unit of account.

Inflation had a different effect on "former gold-unit" countries. They could seek refuge in converting paper to metal. In other countries, inflation would eat away the "former bronze-unit" denomination. Britain is only now getting into that phase, as its traditional policy changed from "maintain a hard currency and accept high unemployment and misery" to "fight unemployment and let the currency sink" only in the interbellum (there may well be a link between the former policy with socialist political power in the UK, but I didn't research that.) Due to these developments the UK example you give is an exception and not the rule.

As for representing the basic unit of account as a coin, this is an emotional question, therefore a political decision. The basic unit is like the national airline: a national calling card. I would expect that not only the coin would exist, it would also look reasonably good. Think of traditional high inflation high middle income countries, such as those in Central and South America. or the former Yugoslavia, where the basic unit was replaced by a new unit whenever the coin disappeared or became too small, light or of an "inferior" metal. Even in developed countries (France is an example), the basic unit was re-denominated when it had become an aluminium coin.

Peter
An unidentified coin is a piece of metal. An identified coin is a piece of history.

Alan71

Quote from: <k> on June 29, 2023, 12:37:56 PMIt could be the case that the Isle of Man and the Channel Islands still use pound notes alongside their pound coins, but I do not know. However, we have some knowledgeable forum members who may know.
Isle of Man uses its own £1 note in addition to its own £1 coin (still the round type).  In theory this means that some old round UK £1 coins may circulate there but I'm not sure if that's the case.

Both Jersey and Guernsey still use their own £1 notes in addition to the UK 12-sided £1 coin.  When the old round pound was withdrawn, this included Jersey's and Guernsey's versions, and neither Bailiwick has so far replaced them, meaning the UK £1 coin is the only version to circulate there.

<k>

Quote from: Alan71 on June 29, 2023, 01:43:06 PMBoth Jersey and Guernsey still use their own £1 notes in addition to the UK 12-sided £1 coin.  When the old round pound was withdrawn, this included Jersey's and Guernsey's versions, and neither Bailiwick has so far replaced them, meaning the UK £1 coin is the only version to circulate there.

Interesting. I never knew that. Jersey and Guernsey must be thinking of introducing their own 12-sided £1 coin, then. The UK's pound coin is apparently due for a new reverse design this year, but it's getting late in the year now, and we also have a new monarch.
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krishna

In India the Ambit of release of coins belongs to the ministry of finance where as the Ambit of releasing currency notes belongs to the Reserve Bank of India
Both are coordinated by the Reserve Bank of India but still the issuing authorities are different

 is that so in the cases of all countries, or is it only particularly relevant to India?

<k>

In the UK, the Treasury liaises with the Royal Mint where new circulation coins are concerned. I imagine that it must also liaise with the Bank of England with regard to banknotes.

In 1983 the government decided that the pound note would be withdrawn a few months after the issue of the pound coin. This was a political decision by the government. Prime Minister Margaret Thatcher did not like the idea of a pound coin at all, but she accepted that there was a demand for one from business and retail.
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Alan71

Quote from: <k> on June 29, 2023, 04:24:05 PMIn 1983 the government decided that the pound note would be withdrawn a few months after the issue of the pound coin.
This isn't what actually happened.  The £1 note continued to be produced after April 1983 and wasn't finally withdrawn until 11 March 1988.

I can't see either Jersey or Guernsey issuing their own 12-sided £1 coins.  They clearly aren't going to withdraw their £1 notes, and if they decide to go down the polymer route, it's even less likely as the notes will last longer.  Plus the ever increasing use of cashless payments makes new circulation coin issues less worthwhile.

Guernsey hasn't had any circulation coinage issued since the 2012-dated issues, and Jersey not since 2016 (though it's possible there are surplus supplies of these dates still to be put into circulation).

<k>

Quote from: Alan71 on June 29, 2023, 07:51:36 PMThis isn't what actually happened.  The £1 note continued to be produced after April 1983 and wasn't finally withdrawn until 11 March 1988.

From Wikipedia:

The one pound note was issued by the Bank of England for the first time in 1797 and continued to be printed until 1984.

That's the date that I was thinking of. It seemed to disappear from circulation relatively quickly after the pound coin was produced.
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eurocoin

Quote from: <k> on June 29, 2023, 04:03:33 PMJersey and Guernsey must be thinking of introducing their own 12-sided £1 coin, then.

No, it is not going to happen. There is no interest on the islands to introduce new local 1 pound coins. They will just use the UK 1 pound coin, and the local 1 pound notes.

<k>

Quote from: eurocoin on June 29, 2023, 10:46:59 PMNo, it is not going to happen. There is no interest on the islands to introduce new local 1 pound coins. They will just use the UK 1 pound coin, and the local 1 pound notes.

So the introduction of the UK 12-sided bimetallic pound coin has triggered the loss of all Jersey and Guernsey pound coins. Not what I would have expected. Meanwhile, the Isle of Man and Gibraltar have continued issuing old style round coins, but with new designs when required. Only the Falkland Islands have issued a circulating 12-sided bimetallic pound coin. St. Helena-Ascension has issued no new coins at all since 2015, so we do not yet know which way they will jump.
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Alan71

Quote from: <k> on June 29, 2023, 07:59:33 PMFrom Wikipedia:

The one pound note was issued by the Bank of England for the first time in 1797 and continued to be printed until 1984.
That would appear to confirm that it was printed for at least a year after the £1 coin was issued.  That's quite odd.  They would not, for instance, have continued producing the round £1 coin once the 12-sided version was issued.

Big_M

I believe Bahrain and Oman are such cases, no circulating coins denominated in, respectively, dinars and rials. Note, the currency units there are equal to 1.000 subunits.

Another case is the Bahamas, with the highest circulating denomination being 25 cents.