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Falus of Kabul mint with flower containing cross-hatching dated (12)56 AH

Started by jkk, November 17, 2022, 05:27:49 PM

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jkk

For those who might remember me, I should explain where I've been. I have this large quantity of Afghan-region coins, a collection I bought from an estate sale. They go from Mauryan to modern. For example, there must be over 500 jitals. You all have taught me a lot and I've been using the information as a resource for my coin club. Now and then I check in here, hoping to help someone, but there is always someone with a better and quicker answer than I can offer.

Now and then I dig back into these south-central Asian coins. Here is one, superficially similar to another I posted today but differing markedly on the reverse. I'm not sure the obverse alignment matters and I took my best guess at reverse alignment. 8.5g, 21mm. Anyone recognize it? No luck in MWI, but I'm capable of looking in entirely the wrong place.

islamic_copper2_obv.jpgislamic_copper2_rev.jpg 
Jonathan

saro

Nice coincidence !, see this today post with a similar cross in circle.
Kabul mint with another design.
"All I know is that I know nothing" (Socrates)

jkk

Quote from: saro on November 17, 2022, 06:08:04 PMNice coincidence !, see this today post with a similar cross in circle.
Kabul mint with another design.


Nice coincidence indeed, saro, thank you. So do you think it's a Kabul civic copper? I saw the discussion about Sikh possibilities and will keep an eye on that discussion in case it also solves my attribution.
Jonathan

saro

A sikh origin was a guess and we can forget it...
Your coin shows quite clearly the mintname : Kabul ("falus Kabul" written with cross letters)

islamic_copper2.jpg
"All I know is that I know nothing" (Socrates)

jkk

Okay, I see those; quite clear now that you so kindly traced the text for me. Can you attribute the timeframe and government?
Jonathan

saro

Quote from: jkk on November 17, 2022, 08:20:46 PMCan you attribute the timeframe and government?
Difficult to say as your coin is undated and on Desibot's coin we can see only "12". Valentine n°9, 13, 19, 26 & 28 shows similar calligraphies of reverses and are dated from 1218 to 1258 and so we can presume that your coin has been minted at this time.
"All I know is that I know nothing" (Socrates)

jkk

Much appreciated again, saro. I took that information and went through the Durrani and Barazkai references on zeno.ru. I did not get much except that as time goes on, the coppers look less and less like mine.

It seems safe to suppose that it is a civic copper of Kabul, anonymous, Durrani, from AH 1218-1239 (at which point the Barazkais begin and the designs diverge from any resemblance to my coin beyond the mint name. Do you think that's overly speculative on my part?
Jonathan

saro

One main characteristic of civic coppers is that they never show a ruler's name but only a mintname; weights  may differ , often re-struck and when dateless, it's only from their style that we can estimate a datation.
I think that your deduction is the good one and that it isn't possible to be more precise. :) .
"All I know is that I know nothing" (Socrates)

saro

Looking attentively at the reverse of your coin, with a rotation and  brightness optimization, I would see "sanah سنه ??56  " ...
(the 2 first digits are not legible on the picture : 1256 ?)
islamic_copper2_obv.jpg
"All I know is that I know nothing" (Socrates)

jkk

That's excellent, saro. I would never have picked that up. AH 1256 would be more Barazkai, I think. I have a hard time imagining how the 56 could mean anything else.
Jonathan

saro

Quote from: jkk on November 18, 2022, 05:13:12 PMAH 1256 would be more Barazkai.
1256 may fit with the 3rd reign of the Durrani Shuja al-mulk, struggling with the Barakzaï Dost Muhammad himself in hands of the Sikh Ranjit Singh...
Shah Shuja was placed on the throne by british before he was assassinated few years later.

Shah Shuja was the owner of the famous Koh-i-nor and forced to give it up to Ranjit against his freedom.
"All I know is that I know nothing" (Socrates)