Author Topic: Roman 4th cent. barbarous imitation, a bit Indian in style  (Read 302 times)

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Offline Pellinore

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Roman 4th cent. barbarous imitation, a bit Indian in style
« on: April 21, 2019, 09:52:18 AM »
Recently this nice coin came my way. It is a barbarous imitation of a VLPP, Two Victories follis issued by Constantine the Great. The portrait is a bit like the Sri Lanka Roman imitations, but to judge by the fabric, that's much thicker than the small and thin Indian imitations, it is a European imitation of about the same dimensions as the original: 19 mm, 2.75 gr. But if you can tell me more, I'd like to know!

-- Paul


Offline Arminius

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Re: Roman 4th cent. barbarous imitation, a bit Indian in style
« Reply #1 on: April 21, 2019, 09:46:19 PM »
Recently this nice coin came my way. It is a barbarous imitation of a VLPP, Two Victories follis issued by Constantine the Great. The portrait is a bit like the Sri Lanka Roman imitations, but to judge by the fabric, that's much thicker than the small and thin Indian imitations, it is a European imitation of about the same dimensions as the original: 19 mm, 2.75 gr. But if you can tell me more, I'd like to know!

-- Paul

Yes i can:

Constantin Ier imitation
A/ légende dégénérée, buste casqué, lauré et cuirassé à droite,
R/ légende dégénérée, 2 victoires debout face à face tenant un bouclier sur un cippe – imitation du type VICTORIAE LAETAE PRINC PERP
 – 19 mm / 2,74 g -

Source vente Savoca Numismatik, 18 th blue auction, 31 mars 2019

Found another die match of the obverse die:



Ae3 imitation
A/ légende dégénérée, buste cuirassé à droite,
R/ légende dégénérée, 2 victoires debout face à face tenant un bouclier sur un cippe – imitation du type VICTORIAE LAETAE PRINC PERP
 – 18 mm / 3,41 g -
Source vente e-bay mars 2016, prix obtenu : 33,60 €

... and probably this one:



Ae3 Constantin Ier imitation
A/ légende dégénérée, buste casqué, lauré et cuirassé à droite,
R/ légende dégénérée, 2 victoires debout face à face tenant un bouclier sur un cippe – imitation du type VICTORIAE LAETAE PRINC PERP
 – 2,4 g -
Source vente e-bay mars 2015 : 11,49 €

 ;)
« Last Edit: April 21, 2019, 10:02:55 PM by Arminius »

Offline Figleaf

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Re: Roman 4th cent. barbarous imitation, a bit Indian in style
« Reply #2 on: April 21, 2019, 10:19:29 PM »
But who issued these? A Balkan tribe?

Peter
An unidentified coin is a piece of metal. An identified coin is a piece of history.

Offline Pellinore

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Re: Roman 4th cent. barbarous imitation, a bit Indian in style
« Reply #3 on: April 21, 2019, 11:57:40 PM »
Great, what a surprise, my coin type is known to others! Often, the more unusual barbarous imitations I know are one of a kind. Like these ones.

-- Paul


Offline Pellinore

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Re: Roman 4th cent. barbarous imitation, a bit Indian in style
« Reply #4 on: April 22, 2019, 12:02:45 AM »
I forgot this one, an excellent imitation in good style with even some silvering.

-- Paul


Offline EWC

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Re: Roman 4th cent. barbarous imitation, a bit Indian in style
« Reply #5 on: April 22, 2019, 11:46:31 AM »
I recall there was a big lot of Ceylonese barbarous Roman copies kicking round England a long time back - around the 1970's - but I saw none since.

However there were lots of barbarous issues around later on - maybe that was in the 1990's? - I got the impression at the time they maybe came from North Africa?

Has anyone published a regional analysis of this stuff?  Its periferal to my interets so I never followed it up.

Rob T

Offline Figleaf

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Re: Roman 4th cent. barbarous imitation, a bit Indian in style
« Reply #6 on: April 22, 2019, 12:47:47 PM »
The barbarous issues are more prevalent in individual finds, so they tend to be found by metal detectorists, rather than archeologists. This is not a problem in countries with good treasure trove laws, such as the UK, but it means significant loss of information in countries with deplorable treasure trove laws, such as France, Germany and Italy.

Peter
An unidentified coin is a piece of metal. An identified coin is a piece of history.