Author Topic: A fals that came in with some Qarakhanids  (Read 236 times)

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Offline Pellinore

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A fals that came in with some Qarakhanids
« on: May 10, 2018, 08:55:41 AM »
Can you help me with this AE fals? It came in with a few 12th century Qarakhanids. 27 mm, 2.73 gr. Not much rim text left. Still, I like it.

-- Paul

(PS. Changed the picture to show the obverse right side up.)
« Last Edit: May 10, 2018, 02:10:32 PM by Pellinore »

Offline THCoins

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Re: A fals that came in with some Qarakhanids
« Reply #1 on: May 10, 2018, 10:56:04 AM »
Like it to , but unfortunately can not provide much help. Just that the left picture is upside down ?
The octagonal cartouche might provide a clue, but is no immediate pointer to me.

Offline Figleaf

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Re: A fals that came in with some Qarakhanids
« Reply #2 on: May 10, 2018, 12:37:36 PM »
Being pattern-oriented, I went through Mitchiner and found an Ilkhan fals of Tifliz that looks good to me (MWI 1674.) However, the type does not occur in Zeno and the pattern looks quite familiar, so it may have been assigned to another area or era since Mitchiner.

Peter
An unidentified coin is a piece of metal. An identified coin is a piece of history.

Offline Pellinore

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Re: A fals that came in with some Qarakhanids
« Reply #3 on: May 10, 2018, 02:11:14 PM »
Like it to , but unfortunately can not provide much help. Just that the left picture is upside down ?

That was very dumb of me. I changed the picture.
-- Paul

Offline Pellinore

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Re: A fals that came in with some Qarakhanids
« Reply #4 on: May 10, 2018, 06:56:45 PM »
Being pattern-oriented, I went through Mitchiner and found an Ilkhan fals of Tifliz that looks good to me (MWI 1674.) However, the type does not occur in Zeno and the pattern looks quite familiar, so it may have been assigned to another area or era since Mitchiner.

Peter

Not less pattern-oriented, I went through five SNAT volumes and some other books, to no avail. That cartouche form one finds also in late Qarakhanid broad dirhams, and the wafer thin fabric of the bronze fals plus the lettering points in a 1100-1220 direction - I think. Ilkhan bronzes are thicker, differently made.

I was wondering about these little bits of text at the top op the obverse, that are engraved in rather different lettering. And maybe the coin was clipped - it would have been about 32 mm then, a broad AE dirham.
-- Paul

Offline Pellinore

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Re: A fals that came in with some Qarakhanids
« Reply #5 on: May 10, 2018, 08:08:14 PM »
One of those late Qarakhanids with comparable design:

AE broad dirham Qarakhanids. Ibrahim bin Husayn 1178-1203. Mint of Uzkend. 30 mm. 3.36 gr. Album 3416.

-- Paul

Offline THCoins

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Re: A fals that came in with some Qarakhanids
« Reply #6 on: May 10, 2018, 09:48:44 PM »
In the center at the top is a "la" ligature. The whole word might be "Jalal"?

Offline Pellinore

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Re: A fals that came in with some Qarakhanids
« Reply #7 on: May 10, 2018, 10:55:08 PM »
Great! I can think of several Jalals of the period.
Paul