Author Topic: Coins struck on other coins  (Read 628 times)

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Offline mrbadexample

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Coins struck on other coins
« on: December 20, 2016, 08:02:02 PM »
Evening all.

I can't find a similar thread...hopefully it's in approximately the right place.

Yesterday andyg posted his 1836 Belgian 2 centimes, overstruck on an 1823 Dutch half cent: http://www.worldofcoins.eu/forum/index.php/topic,37463.msg236317.html#msg236317

This appeals to me. I like the fact you can still see some detail of the host coin.

I looked recently at purchasing this BOE dollar, which unfortunately went to someone with deeper pockets. I liked the amount of detail remaining from the host coin, which I think is a Bolivian 8 reales, KM #55. (This link to bigger pictures https://www.dnw.co.uk/auctions/catalogue/lot.php?auction_id=443&lot_id=1841)

I view these almost like having two coins in one. I'd like to see if I can acquire one or two for my collection, but first I need to know what else is out there.

So, what have you got that used to be something else please?

Thanks,
MBE :)

Online bagerap

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Re: Coins struck on other coins
« Reply #1 on: December 20, 2016, 08:54:10 PM »
Brasil had a habit of overstamping its own coinage for revaluation. Plenty of those about, and cheap.

Offline Afrasi

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Re: Coins struck on other coins
« Reply #2 on: December 20, 2016, 09:55:35 PM »
Here is one example from Brazil. But I bought it not cheap and I swapped it even better into a very rare African coin..

Offline malj1

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Re: Coins struck on other coins
« Reply #3 on: December 20, 2016, 10:28:41 PM »
Australia over-struck dollars in another way creating now very valuable coins that you or I are unlikely ever to own. See Wikipedia
Malcolm
Have a look at  my tokens and my banknotes.

Offline mrbadexample

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Re: Coins struck on other coins
« Reply #4 on: December 21, 2016, 12:43:05 AM »
Brasil had a habit of overstamping its own coinage for revaluation. Plenty of those about, and cheap.

Do you mean the whole coin or the 40/80 countermarks on various reis I've seen?

I'm looking for the whole coin...

Offline mrbadexample

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Re: Coins struck on other coins
« Reply #5 on: December 21, 2016, 12:56:08 AM »
Here is one example from Brazil. But I bought it not cheap and I swapped it even better into a very rare African coin..

That's nice Afrasi, and to be able to identify the host coin to date level. The African coin must have been pretty special...

Offline mrbadexample

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Re: Coins struck on other coins
« Reply #6 on: December 21, 2016, 01:01:21 AM »
Australia over-struck dollars in another way creating now very valuable coins that you or I are unlikely ever to own. See Wikipedia

Cheers Mal, how about one that I might eventually be able to afford!  :P

I was aware of these but not of just how scarce they are.  :o

Offline malj1

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Re: Coins struck on other coins
« Reply #7 on: December 21, 2016, 04:15:35 AM »
I started a new topic:  Tokens struck on other tokens

This shows a token overstruck on a NO VALUE token.
Malcolm
Have a look at  my tokens and my banknotes.

Online bagerap

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Re: Coins struck on other coins
« Reply #8 on: December 21, 2016, 11:27:34 AM »
Do you mean the whole coin or the 40/80 countermarks on various reis I've seen?

I'm looking for the whole coin...


Yes, I did mean those, but I'm trying to find a Swedish coin I have somewhere as the Swedes did something similar with the skilling currency. Can't remember if it was a countermark or an overstrike.

Offline FosseWay

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Re: Coins struck on other coins
« Reply #9 on: December 21, 2016, 12:09:26 PM »
Do you mean the whole coin or the 40/80 countermarks on various reis I've seen?

I'm looking for the whole coin...


Yes, I did mean those, but I'm trying to find a Swedish coin I have somewhere as the Swedes did something similar with the skilling currency. Can't remember if it was a countermark or an overstrike.

I think I have something like this. Will check when I get home.

Offline andyg

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Re: Coins struck on other coins
« Reply #10 on: December 21, 2016, 12:33:14 PM »
Afghanistan - over an Iranian 50 Shahi.
always willing to trade modern UK coins for modern coins from elsewhere....

Offline andyg

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Re: Coins struck on other coins
« Reply #11 on: December 21, 2016, 12:45:01 PM »
Guatemala - Centavo 1881 over 1871
always willing to trade modern UK coins for modern coins from elsewhere....

Offline andyg

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Re: Coins struck on other coins
« Reply #12 on: December 21, 2016, 01:26:28 PM »
Russia 2 Kopeks 1766 over 1762 4 Kopeks
always willing to trade modern UK coins for modern coins from elsewhere....

Offline andyg

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Re: Coins struck on other coins
« Reply #13 on: December 21, 2016, 01:33:11 PM »
Russia again - 10 Kopeks 1762 over 5 Kopeks (1758-1762)
always willing to trade modern UK coins for modern coins from elsewhere....

Offline Bob L.

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Re: Coins struck on other coins
« Reply #14 on: December 22, 2016, 03:34:22 AM »
Here’s an ancient overstrike of mine with an interesting backstory:


Vonones I
tetradrachm, 8 - 12 AD
Sellwood 60.2

The coin is overstruck on a joint-issue tetradrachm of Vonones’ brother and mother, Phraataces and Musa, who together had murdered Vonones’ father.  That undertype is shown here, courtesy of Parthia.com:



Musa was a Roman concubine who was given by Augustus to the Parthian King Phraates IV during a period in which the empires weren’t warring.  She and her (and Phraates’) son Phraataces poisoned Phraates, then married each other (yes, mother and son married each other) and took over the Parthian throne as co-rulers from 2 BC until being overthrown by the Parthian nobility in 4 AD.  During their joint reign mother/son/husband/wife issued coins that show both of their images.  Extant unaltered tetradrachms, as seen above, are very rare.

Now, prior to claiming the Parthian throne, Vonones, who was a brother of Phraataces, had been captive in Rome as part of a treaty the Romans made with their father Phraates IV.  Around 6 AD Augustus sent Vonones to Parthia to be king.  Things did not go well: “…the refined, or effeminate, habits that he had acquired in Rome soon disgusted his subjects (and) he showed a marked distaste for such typically Parthian occupations as hunting and riding.” (Wroth)  He ended up battling against another member of the Arsacid clan, Artabanus II, for the rulership.  Eventually Artabanus won out and had Vonones murdered.

But while he was claimant to the throne, Vonones issued coins that had his name spelled out in Greek (a very unusual thing for a Parthian ruler to do...their personal names rarely appeared on coinage), along with the legend translating as “conqueror of Artabanus” – commemorating a temporary victory over his rival.

Many of Vonones’ tetradrachms are overstruck on the tets that his brother Phraataces struck with his mother/wife Musa.  While this may have been done for expediency given how quickly Vonones became immersed in the political power struggle with Artabanus, it seems to me that overstriking coins of his father’s murderers may have brought some sense of satisfaction for Vonones.

Rarely is the Phraataces/Musa undertype clearly visible on Vonones I tets, and indeed I own another one where the undertype is hard to make out.  But on the coin here the profile of Phaataces is easy to see on the reverse: