Author Topic: Just added two Bull and horseman Jitals: Iltutmish & Sharaf Beg, Nandana mint  (Read 4278 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline THCoins

  • Honorary Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5 517
Adding another interesting coin to this thread. Above already were two pictures of the Nandana mint Bull and Horseman Jitals issued under the name of "Shalipha Baga".
Just encountered another specimen which shows similarities, but also differences, with the previous ones.
The coin is 14 mm, 3.6 grams and of fairly good workmanship in a low silver/high copper billon. The style of the bull and horseman  is "post-Muhammad bin Sam", but not the typical Nandana style.
The text above the horseman appears to be the common "Sri Hamira". Here, the "Ha"of "HaMiRa"is not the typical style of the Nandana type, but more similar to the Delhli style of writing.
The text around the bull is where the bonus is. The left part seems to read "Sri Shalipha" as on the Sharaf Beg coins. However, the next word, commencing above the bump of the bull is definitely not "Baga". The first character is likely to be read as "Na" or "Ta". So, this is a, previously unpublished as far as i know, bull and horseman in the name of some other caliph. Alternatively, this is an interesting legend copying error.
The first candidates would be the reigning Abassid caliphs. At the time of the downfall of Mangubarni this was Al-Nasir. That would fit with the first character, but not with the visible part of the second. Al-Nasir was succeeded by his son Zahir. This does not fit with the proposed "Na" or "Ta" beginning. However, Sanskrit does not have a character for "Za". A way out might be to spell this as "Tahir" which would fit, but is a long shot.

In conclusion; this is a nice bull and horseman jital which seems to be a variant of the rare Sharaf Beg type, in the name of some other Khalif. Whether this is an inscription blunder on a local copy, or a ligitimate yet unknown issue, is yet to be decided.
Now i just have to wait for a specimen with the entire name on the flan  :-\
« Last Edit: October 09, 2019, 12:52:30 PM by THCoins »

Offline Rajagopal

  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 458
Re: Just added two Bull and horseman Jitals: Iltutmish & Sharaf Beg, Nandana mint
« Reply #16 on: September 10, 2016, 08:23:53 AM »
Need confirmation...Is this also a coin of Sharaf Beg? if not, i will remove it from this thread..weight is 3 grams...Thanks

Offline THCoins

  • Honorary Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5 517
Re: Just added two Bull and horseman Jitals: Iltutmish & Sharaf Beg, Nandana mint
« Reply #17 on: September 10, 2016, 12:49:15 PM »
Very nice catch ! No need to remove, it's a welcome addition to the thread.
This indeed is a Sharaf Beg Jital. The visible part of the legend clearly shows {Li}"Pha Ba"{Ga}. Having also the first part of the final "Ga" on the flan is a nice bonus.
I have seen several of this type recently on offer. Likely a hoard with more of these has been uncovered. I also have one with a similar surface aspect as yours. And i am quite certain it has been chemically treated or even resilvered to get this combination of a bit corroded uneven surface and a shiny new silver look. I whish the seller would not have done this. Apart from that, great find !

Anthony

Offline Rajagopal

  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 458
Re: Just added two Bull and horseman Jitals: Iltutmish & Sharaf Beg, Nandana mint
« Reply #18 on: September 11, 2016, 09:29:10 AM »
Thanks a lot..actually it was this thread on worldofcoins which helped me to hunt this down...and as you said earlier, at the price of two coffees..

Offline THCoins

  • Honorary Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5 517
Re: Just added two Bull and horseman Jitals: Iltutmish & Sharaf Beg, Nandana mint
« Reply #19 on: September 11, 2016, 11:02:20 AM »
And that's the spirit of the Forum. So we may all help eachother a bit !

Offline capnbirdseye

  • Vic
  • Moderator
  • Honorary Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6 310
Re: Just added two Bull and horseman Jitals: Iltutmish & Sharaf Beg, Nandana mint
« Reply #20 on: September 11, 2016, 11:22:33 AM »
Well spotted by Rajagopal!, 
 the chemical treatment of coins is becoming more prevalent unfortunately, this morning I've been trying to darken some tiny bright shiny Ottoman acke coins which came to me mirror bright and my usual treatment with sulphur failed on some of them because they also appear to have some kind of treatment to prevent tarnishing  >:D >:D
Vic

Offline THCoins

  • Honorary Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5 517
Re: Just added two Bull and horseman Jitals: Iltutmish & Sharaf Beg, Nandana mint
« Reply #21 on: September 11, 2016, 07:03:19 PM »
Don't know for sure if the top layer on these treated coins is silver. Would have to take out my chemistry set to test. For now i just leave it as it is.

Offline capnbirdseye

  • Vic
  • Moderator
  • Honorary Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6 310
Re: Just added two Bull and horseman Jitals: Iltutmish & Sharaf Beg, Nandana mint
« Reply #22 on: September 12, 2016, 05:36:42 PM »
Here is a clip from a Fb group, image courtesy of Pawan K Puri

Looks like a new type with a cross symbol?

Sind Sultan Khalif Beg Jitals ( Obverse is Sh Shalapha Paiga or Bega in Cursive nagri and Reverse is Sri hamirah ) 1st to 4th coin are same 5th is Different & 6 and 7th coin are also different this is a new varieties jital of this ruler
« Last Edit: September 12, 2016, 08:53:30 PM by capnbirdseye »
Vic

Offline THCoins

  • Honorary Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5 517
Re: Just added two Bull and horseman Jitals: Iltutmish & Sharaf Beg, Nandana mint
« Reply #23 on: September 12, 2016, 07:54:26 PM »
The #6 and #7 type are similar to the one i showed in reply#15 in this thread. Look at the character after the "Pha". This clearly is not "Ba". So i agree this is a new uncataloged type.
I do not agree the shown # 1 to 4 are the same. Look at the "Ta" (or "Ti") after "Pha" on #2. Also if you compare the bull on #4 and #2, #4 has a typical "Nandana mint style" nose. Numer 2 has not.
Also it is not entirely new to appear: look at this one on Zeno. Although R. Tye suggested this is a Qubacha type, i do not agree. It has the same + signs on the bull, and a clear "Ti" after "Pha".
 
« Last Edit: September 12, 2016, 08:39:59 PM by THCoins »

Offline capnbirdseye

  • Vic
  • Moderator
  • Honorary Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6 310
Re: Just added two Bull and horseman Jitals: Iltutmish & Sharaf Beg, Nandana mint
« Reply #24 on: September 12, 2016, 08:51:59 PM »
I'll see what replies the FB post gets, I've enlarged the photo a bit as well
Vic

Offline THCoins

  • Honorary Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5 517
Re: Just added two Bull and horseman Jitals: Iltutmish & Sharaf Beg, Nandana mint
« Reply #25 on: September 13, 2016, 10:29:18 AM »
I have been trying to make sense ot the legend a bit this morning. "Sri Khaliphati" seems unlikely to be a reference to the caliph of Bagdad.
According to the dictionaries, it may be used as "Successor"/"Representative"/"vice-regent". And there are some historic figures around this time and place who used this title (Malik Qabul Khaliphati for example). Possibly this new type is either a later version, or an alternate mint version, of the coins referring to Ozbeg Bei, the governor of Nandana in the service of Mangubarni. I would love to see one with the entire end of the name on flan.
Looking for other contemporary candidates for the "Khaliphati Baga", Qutb al-din Aibak (or ai-Beg) comes to mind. But i do not find any evidence he held Nandana.
Alternatively, "Khaliphati Baga" could also be a generic title like "Spalapati Deva". As "Beg" is the turkic title for "Lord", the inscription could just be interpreted as issued in the name of "the lord vice-regent".
 
« Last Edit: September 14, 2016, 09:23:19 AM by THCoins »

Offline Rajagopal

  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 458
Finally, got an 'iltitimi ' coin. G/G D 46..3.52 grams. But there is slight difference compared to the drawing given in G/G ..On my coin the 'i' of 'mi' in 'iltitimi is placed to the right of 'ma' character while in G/G it is on the left of 'ma' character..Any significance?..thanks

Offline THCoins

  • Honorary Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5 517
Good observation ! I myself have only seen the type you show. I never encountered one with i-matra of "Mi" to the left even though also the Tye ctalog draws it in this manner.

Offline drnsreedhar

  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 487
And my coin of Khalif Beg. This one is not a perfect piece, but thanks to WoC, I could make an attribution.

Dr.Sreedhar

Offline THCoins

  • Honorary Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5 517
I believe the last coin is a quite typical specimen for the quality with which these were minted.
I gradually becomes clearer that these coins are not as rare as once thought. People just did not recognize them. It's a great thing that the sharing of information on WoC can benefit collectors like this !