Author Topic: Zangids of Mosul, Badr al-Din Lulu, 631 AH S&S type 68  (Read 3364 times)

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Offline bububoy

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Re: Badr al-Din Lulu from Mosul, 631 AH S&S type 68
« Reply #15 on: May 29, 2015, 12:55:30 AM »
mahe

Sorry for the delay, I missed your post earlier.

dear alan,
thanks for helping me identify these coins.
I think this post was actually meant to be a "Hello, Welcome" message and turned out to something more interesting, may be we should move this to the Islamic section.

mahe

Offline Manzikert

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Re: Badr al-Din Lulu from Mosul, 631 AH S&S type 68
« Reply #16 on: May 29, 2015, 01:25:33 AM »
I must point out that (as I did say in my post) this lovely image is not mine, I copied it from the Zeno website where it is No. 129745. I would very much like one of these to go with the Badr al-Din Lulu one.

Thank you Peter for splitting this post off.

Alan

Offline Pellinore

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Re: Badr al-Din Lulu from Mosul, 631 AH S&S type 68
« Reply #17 on: May 29, 2015, 02:42:08 AM »
@bububoy
In total, I have eleven pictorial AE Islamic Atabeg coins. Here's my nice Spengler & Sayles 81 one, that's your second type.
Can't read the exact date. It should be 596, could be 597 too, but I'm a poor Arabic reader. It's the tamgha type. I love the Kufic writing on the reverse.
Weight is 10,74 gr. and diameter 25,06 mm. 

Paul

Offline bububoy

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Re: Badr al-Din Lulu from Mosul, 631 AH S&S type 68
« Reply #18 on: May 29, 2015, 05:44:46 AM »
Dear Paul,
thanks for sharing i like the white coloring on your coin, this makes the coin details standout !
btw whats up with the nose ?

mahe

Offline Manzikert

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Re: Badr al-Din Lulu from Mosul, 631 AH S&S type 68
« Reply #19 on: May 29, 2015, 10:46:04 AM »
Paul

According to S&S the tamgha only appears on some (presumably earlier) pieces from 596 and is then dropped, not appearing at all on 597. The date is reasonably clear on yours and (with the aid of Plant :) ) I've annotated your image below.

Alan

Offline Pellinore

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Re: Badr al-Din Lulu from Mosul, 631 AH S&S type 68
« Reply #20 on: May 29, 2015, 06:24:26 PM »
Thanks, I was in doubt about the sitt (= 6) having a 'stroke up' at the end, but maybe it's the 'a', S & S says the form sitta was used by these coins. Otherwise it goes into the direction of seb' (= 7) without a 'stroke down'. (I followed a course of Arabic when I was 18, but alas, I was much too lazy at the time to finish it. Besides, it was mainly spoken Arabic).
But I take it this is a 596 coin = AD 1199-1200.

'What's up with the nose' is a tamgha, identical with the tamgha at the foot of the inscription of the reverse. Looks a bit strange. I always wonder what the users of these coins were thinking, because of the bizarre portraits. Were they serious about them, a sort of holiness? Or were they just laughing at the Christians? Did they pay each other, or were these coins destined for 'international' trade?

S & S (Vol. 2, pp. xiv-xxiii) have an interesting theory about the designers of the coins. But I would expect the users would comment extensively and possibly negatively on the designs.

Paul

Offline Quant.Geek

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Lu'lu'ids: Badr al-Din Lu'lu' (1233-1258) AE Dirham, al-Mawsil (Album-1874.1)
« Reply #21 on: January 15, 2016, 03:19:01 AM »
Lu'lu'ids: Badr al-Din Lu'lu' (1233-1258) AE Dirham, al-Mawsil, AH631 (Album-1874.1)

Obv: In beaded square, diademed head in profile facing left, hair in ringlets, eight-pointed star in bottom left corner; in margins -ﺿﺮﺏ ﺑﺎﻟﻤﻮﺻﻞ ﺳﻨﺔ ﺍﺣﺪ ﻭ ﺛﻠﺜﻴﻦ ﻭﺳﺘﻤﺎﺋﺔ (Struck in al-Mawsil the year one and thirty and six hundred)
Rev: In Naskh script, in center - ﺍﻻﻣﺎﻡ ﺍﻟﻤﺴﺘﻨﺼﺮ ﺑﺎﻟﻠﺔ ﺍﻣﻴﺮﺍﻟﻤﺆﻣﻨﻴﻦ (The Imam, al-Mustansir billah, Commander of the Faithful); in margins -ﺑﺪﺮ ﺍﻟﺪﻧﻴﺎﻭﺍﻟﺪﻳﻦ ﻟﻮﻟﻮ ﺍﻟﻤﻠﻚ ﺍﻟﻜﺎﻣﻞ ﺍﻟﻤﻠﻚﺍﻻﺷﺮﻑ (Resplendent Moon of the World and the Faith, Lu‘lu‘, the Perfect King, the Honored King)

Overstruck on an undetermined type, as usual...

A high-resolution image of this coin is available at FORVM Ancient Coins

A gallery of my coins can been seen at FORVM Ancient Coins

Offline Figleaf

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I had never heard of the Lu'lu'id "dynasty" (two rulers), a name that cheered me up :) A good illustration of how coin collecting ceaselessly increases your knowledge.

Peter
An unidentified coin is a piece of metal. An identified coin is a piece of history.

Offline Pellinore

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Re: Zangids of Mosul, Badr al-Din Lulu, 631 AH S&S type 68
« Reply #23 on: January 17, 2016, 12:57:05 PM »
Yes, what does it mean, "lu'lu"?
And what a fine coin, Quant.Geek.
-- Paul

Offline THCoins

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Re: Zangids of Mosul, Badr al-Din Lulu, 631 AH S&S type 68
« Reply #24 on: January 17, 2016, 01:09:18 PM »
Lu'lu means "pearl"as far as i know. This name also indicated that he came from the rank of the "owned" (Mamluks).

Offline Quant.Geek

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Re: Zangids of Mosul, Badr al-Din Lulu, 631 AH S&S type 68
« Reply #25 on: January 17, 2016, 01:37:10 PM »
Lu'lu means "pearl"as far as i know. This name also indicated that he came from the rank of the "owned" (Mamluks).

That is correct as he was a slave of Armenian origin, as the story goes, at least...
A gallery of my coins can been seen at FORVM Ancient Coins