What's the value of my coin?

[alglasser]

I have often wondered how the catalogs establish values of the coins listed therein. I know that with rare U.S. coins, statistics are kept on the number of sales and prices paid (now much easier since "certification"), but for international, obscure pieces, such as my music collection pieces, prices are anyone's guess and I very much admire the work of the SCWC guys for their diligent work in this regard. I use their pricing constantly as a "guideline", and often find coins right on the prrice mark, as well as pieces selling (or should I say "offered") for much higher and much lower prices. One example, though I am sure everyone here has many examples as well:

I have been hunting for a Mongolia KM-54, 1989 25 Tugrik as it has a beautiful picture of a child playing a "horsehead" fiddle. Two are available on E-Bay now for $105. The catalog price in SCWC is $28.50. I found one on DelCampe for about $35 plus shipping, which I ordered. Still waiting but it's only been about 2 weeks. I have picked up gold pieces (small coins...but "scarce" and priced much higher than gold content) but with a bit of hunting, I have purchased them for just a few $ above gold content (before gold went above $1400...my gold buying has slowed considerably).

I guess my point is, as someone else said and I have read countless times in the Numismatic literature, "a coin is worth what someone will pay for it"....or something to that effect.

I collect my music coins for the love of the coins...not the "value". Still, it is nice to know that on many occasions, I have added a coin to my collection at a bargain price in comparison to catalog listings. I got every coin in my collections because I got them for what I was willing to pay for them.

I'm sure it is no secret, that silver coins can be purchased often for significantly below silver content. I have been doing this for years...not as collection coins...but because I am a little bit of a worrier regarding the world situation as a whole and silver/gold might in fact be the only means of negotiable currency at some point. I will probably never see the day this happens, but as a "backup" just in case, it gives me a bit of peace of mind. At $40 an ounce, I picked up a beautiful Austrian Proof 100 schilling coin,.5787 oz of pure silver, for $14 and frequently bid and win on beautiful coins selling for less than their intrinsic value. Ask the question, what's THAT coin worth, and I can tell you to the cent. Ask what my musician coins are worth, and I'd say "priceless" since I have 40 years or more of my life invested in their acquisition. I don't have a lot of "bulk silver", but in a "crisis", I might be able to feed my family for a while. But then...my financial planner keeps reminding me, if things really get bad and there is a worldwide economic collapse, you can't eat gold or silver. He laughingly advises me to collect canned foods.

Did I get off the topic again???    Alan...

[Coinsforever]

I'm ashamed that I missed reading this post.

Thanks to Peter for sharing link in another post. (1 Rand South Africa)

Cheers

[Abhay]

Many a times, I have not purchased a coin or set because the price seemed too high. But I find that the price has jumped to almost 10 times within 6 months. (An example is the Proof set of 89th Inter Parliamentary Conference, which I was getting at Rs. 30,000 at Indore auction, but did not buy, thinking it to be too costly. Now the same set is being sold for about Rs. 2,50,000.00 !!!).

So, what I feel is that if you like something, buy it right there. Because it is better to repent once for buying it at high price, rather to repent for your whole life for not buying it when it was cheap.

Abhay

From Rs. 2.50 Lac in July 2010, the present price is about Rs. 4.00 Lac.

Abhay

[alglasser]

Hello, engipress

You are absolutely correct, of course. Many a time I have waited for the right time...and it never came. There are 3 examples of the Austria KM-3006 gold coin on MA-shop.com that I want...I will watch the prices and if nothing happens in a few days...I will probably buy one...and be murdered by my wife for spending money when we're saving for a cruise. Ahhhhh...such is the life of an old married man.

Does anyone know if it is appropriate to make an offer to a ma-coin dealer? I don't want to violate any guidelines.

Thanks!

Alan in MA

[Md. Shariful Islam]

Hello, engipress

You are absolutely correct, of course. Many a time I have waited for the right time...and it never came. There are 3 examples of the Austria KM-3006 gold coin on MA-shop.com that I want...I will watch the prices and if nothing happens in a few days...I will probably buy one...and be murdered by my wife for spending money when we're saving for a cruise. Ahhhhh...such is the life of an old married man.

Does anyone know if it is appropriate to make an offer to a ma-coin dealer? I don't want to violate any guidelines.

Thanks!

Alan in MA

I have one practical suggestion for you. Before you attempt to buy the coin consult with your life insurance company if they are ready to pay for such peril. If not dont buy.  

[alglasser]

Nope...clause 863 part 2, subsection B.12.88, page 88, sub-section 23, clause 77x states:

"You idiot...you are NOT covered for assault by irrate coin dealers. Don't even TRY it, dumb ass!"

Yes...I guess my policy is pretty clear on that exclusion.

Alan in MA...wondering what good life insurance is...

[akona20]

Is it appropriate to make an offer? It has always been a practice of mine to make an offer for any coin that has a price above $100. Given that many coin dealers have 'clearance' sales at least once a year on stock if they are prepared to accept once then they should be at other times.

[Ancientnoob]

With out mentioning particulars, I have seen this in the ancient coin world. I see very popular fixed price sellers selling ancient "Greek" coins for insane crazy amounts of money. Its not that I disagree with anyone making a profit but yikes, I have seen examples of coins I have (in not as good condition) selling for multiples of what I spent on probably my whole collection. Sometimes in the catalogs I see SOLD, I think to myself, Who in there right mind? I have driven cars worth less. I love the hobby and have spent more then decent and even made concessions else where to procure a good coin, but sheesh, asking something like $500- $2000 USD for a crusty little bronze coin, with little detail, wild. I wouldn't pay that if it had....well God on it.
Ebay is cool too, be careful some people post fakes, either knowingly or unknowingly, but in my experience the majority are great and a good place to find an obscure coin. I have nothing bad say. I am just leery about buying from overseas ( India, China, UK, Bulgaria, Canada and Israel) I have known people who have been ripped off by members from these countries. Also the US Customs office seems to have sticky fingers, on more then one occasion. I don't begrudge anyone willing to do business with these countries, I would just do so at your own risk. You will eventually get your money back but, it might take a half dozen emails and 2 months of frustration and the possibility of missing opportunities to procure the coin from another place.
Nate

Just an example* My avatar is BC 393-284 Athens Tetradrachm intermediate style purchased for approx. $150 USD I have seen people ask $750 regularly and a few go as high as $4000 USD. Boggles my mind. I guess collectors items are really worth what people will pay for them.

[akona20]

A interesing set of discussions.

Use Ebay at your own risk. Frankly it doesn't matter which country the goods are listed in there are a fair proportion of fakes. The biggest dealers in fakes by value have been the UK and the USA by a wide margin and that includes selling fakes as a business to deceive and accidently because they know any better. After being involved for many years fighting against fakes on Ebay they are a complete joke and people make a tidy living out of dealing in fakes with the acceptance of both Ebay and the coin industry. I suggest you look at the French interent auction house of Delcampes, they are good people from the owner down.
So broadly speaking no country is worse than any other when dealing with them.
India for example has a great history of making copies of coins. Often the reason was not really to deceive, as we in the west would understand, but for other purposes. Very recent international discussions over what have called a fake mohur that was to be auctioned at a prominant US auction house showed all facets of this type of coin /token production. If you read a number of threads here especialy on the Indian copies you will see how good some of these are. But given the industry was fooled for many years by some of the greatest fakers the key to buying is have someone you trust selling to you and increasing your own knowledge.
The price of some coins is unbelievable to many people. No discussion would be complete without acknowledging that money laundering is a part of the high end coin, art and artifacts market. That places certain objects out of our reach but then again that was always the case.
This site is rather interesting in that we have contributors and viewers from many countries and contributors who are at the top of world knowledge in their fields. But the bottom line always was, is and always will be, KNOW YOUR PRODUCT.

[alglasser]

I would have rather thought that China would hold the record for fakes, some very well made ones too I might add. Trust me on this as my 1795 U.S. dollar, certified by a reputable company came out as a fake when I resubmitted it to PCGS. I see fakes all the time on E-Bay...some nicely done...some rather comical and have reported many sellers. One dealer in 19th century world crowns got the ax by E-Bay because I noted all of his coins were identically toned. I contacted E-Bay and sure enough...nice fakes. China also has become recognized for their skill in making fake PCGS and, I believe, NGC slabs (I don't collect certified coins anymore...with rare exception. I resent the whole concept and feel slabbing has ruined the hobby...but that's another issue.)
 
Alan   Massachusetts

[Figleaf]

Just cleaning up two small misunderstandings.

Delcampe is Belgian

While the Chinese are probably the most prolific fakers of modern coins, Bulgaria and Romania have the dishonour for Greek and Roman coins.

Peter

[akona20]

My apologies to Seb. I have been watching too much Poirot.