Author Topic: Fire proof safes for coin collection  (Read 3772 times)

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Offline Prosit

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Fire proof safes for coin collection
« on: November 25, 2012, 03:24:49 PM »
I have been told by old time collectors that a safe is a good thing but not the so called fire proof safes. I was told that what makes them fire proof or resistant isn't good for coins.

With that being said I do have a fire resistant/proof lock box (much smaller than a traditional safe) and I do have some coins in it and have for over 10 years.  I see no issues with the coins yet.

Dale

Offline Yogesh5101

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Re: Fire proof safes for coin collection
« Reply #1 on: November 25, 2012, 07:23:22 PM »
As per my knowledge there is nothing in paints and coating which can be said complete fireproof. These coatings etc are fire resistant/flame propagation resistant. These items have limits like it will prevent flame propagation like four hours also same depend on severity level . A wooden safe with good fire resistant sun mica may serve the purpose..

Offline cmerc

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Re: Fire proof safes for coin collection
« Reply #2 on: November 25, 2012, 08:25:56 PM »
Why not a locker in the bank?  I have a safe deposit box in a nearby bank.  It is easy to visit, take coins in and out.  Bank vaults are cheaper than a personal safe, and a lot more secure.  Having a safe in the house may be an invitation for thieves.  Also your safe needs to be heavy and secured to the wall to prevent someone from carrying away the safe.

I also maintain a list of all my coins and also photographs/website, so I can appreciate what I have. 
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Offline malj1

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Re: Fire proof safes for coin collection
« Reply #3 on: November 25, 2012, 10:29:52 PM »
Another alternative, look for a good second hand safe which can be found for the value of just one of those gold coins.

I have two of these, one from a secondhand shop the other I was fortunate to obtain from a locksmith who was replacing his own safe with a larger version; so this I felt was a very good recommendation as he had faith in it himself for many years.
Malcolm
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Offline Prosit

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Re: Fire proof safes for coin collection
« Reply #4 on: November 26, 2012, 12:21:53 AM »
Again I am speaking from second or third hand knowledge but it was my understanding that it isn't the coatings or paint but that fire proof safes are thick walled and that wall is filled with something (insulation) that doesn't like to burn but may release fumes in a fire and may release fumes much more slowly in day to day use and as time goes on.

The little inexpensive "Sentry Safe" I have has walls that are 30mm thick. It isn't heavy enough to be solid metal. I don't know what insulation is in there. However I only put documents in that one like Passports ect.

Dale

As per my knowledge there is nothing in paints and coating which can be said complete fireproof. These coatings etc are fire resistant/flame propagation resistant. These items have limits like it will prevent flame propagation like four hours also same depend on severity level . A wooden safe with good fire resistant sun mica may serve the purpose..

Offline Prosit

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Re: Fire proof safes for coin collection
« Reply #5 on: November 26, 2012, 12:24:43 AM »
It is my personal preference that if I decided to get one it would be an old safe. Being a collector, the idea of having an old interesting looking safe is attractive to me.

Dale




Another alternative, look for a good second hand safe which can be found for the value of just one of those gold coins.

I have two of these, one from a secondhand shop the other I was fortunate to obtain from a locksmith who was replacing his own safe with a larger version; so this I felt was a very good recommendation as he had faith in it himself for many years.

Offline malj1

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Re: Fire proof safes for coin collection
« Reply #6 on: November 26, 2012, 01:08:11 AM »
Again I am speaking from second or third hand knowledge but it was my understanding that it isn't the coatings or paint but that fire proof safes are thick walled and that wall is filled with something (insulation) that doesn't like to burn but may release fumes in a fire and may release fumes much more slowly in day to day use and as time goes on.
Dale

Safes are lined inside and out with steel so as far as I can see there is no way any fumes could escape to harm my coins. Certainly no evidence of that so far in thirty years. Likewise inside a safe a fairly constant temperature is maintained due to the insulation; this I believe has also restricted any pvc sweating etc. from this type of holder.

Both my  safes are marked fireproof but that would apply to the severity of the fire, a good place in the home should be selected, mine is in a single storey part of the house against an outside wall not in the centre of the three storey part where the heat would be the most severe if the unthinkable did happen.
Malcolm
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paisepagal

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Re: Fire proof safes for coin collection
« Reply #7 on: November 26, 2012, 03:38:13 AM »
Again I am speaking from second or third hand knowledge but it was my understanding that it isn't the coatings or paint but that fire proof safes are thick walled and that wall is filled with something (insulation) that doesn't like to burn but may release fumes in a fire and may release fumes much more slowly in day to day use and as time goes on.

The little inexpensive "Sentry Safe" I have has walls that are 30mm thick. It isn't heavy enough to be solid metal. I don't know what insulation is in there. However I only put documents in that one like Passports ect.

Dale


Thanks Dale, yogesh... I'll make sure to ask these questions, ie any fumes released and how long is the safe resistant

Offline Prosit

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Re: Fire proof safes for coin collection
« Reply #8 on: November 26, 2012, 04:10:53 AM »
Yes but we seem to be talking about different products. Best I remember you said your safe was old and I would think from that that it is likely all steel like they used to make them. That is what I would want.

Today's fire-proof safes and especially document safes (and some gun safes too for that matter) have insulation of some sort in the walls, floors and tops unlike the older safes.

Yours may be perfectly fine but I would hate to ASSUME all modern products are created as equal.

Modern products sold as Fire proof are specifically what I have been warned against for coins but have been told they are great for documents.

Let me ask one question. What is the wall of your safe made of, inside and out and especially in between?
Do you know?  I don't. Without that little piece of info seems strange to me to argue their safety for coins one way or the another.  I admit I don't know but the question needs to be asked.

How one safe reacts in a fire seems of little importance to me as that is a rare occurance.  How it behaves on a day to day basis and over a long term is of interest.
Dale








Safes are lined inside and out with steel so as far as I can see there is no way any fumes could escape to harm my coins. Certainly no evidence of that so far in thirty years. Likewise inside a safe a fairly constant temperature is maintained due to the insulation; this I believe has also restricted any pvc sweating etc. from this type of holder.

Both my  safes are marked fireproof but that would apply to the severity of the fire, a good place in the home should be selected, mine is in a single storey part of the house against an outside wall not in the centre of the three storey part where the heat would be the most severe if the unthinkable did happen.

Offline malj1

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Re: Fire proof safes for coin collection
« Reply #9 on: November 26, 2012, 06:00:42 AM »
Both of my safes are all steel construction and totally insulated from whatever is in the four inch space between the inner and outer wall. No way of telling but hopefully there is some dreaded asbestos lining inside! but I imagine its mostly concrete to give it weight, although not bolted down its still almost impossible to move without a crow bar.

One amendment - I should have said fire resistant - not fire proof.

How the safe reacts in a fire is of importance to me as I live in a fire prone area that is said to be one the most dangerous in the world. I have had a few close calls.
Malcolm
Have a look at  my tokens and my banknotes.

Offline dheer

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Re: Fire proof safes for coin collection
« Reply #10 on: November 26, 2012, 06:13:01 AM »
Most of the safes that we get here [cheaply] are good for purpose, it prevent/slow down a theif to an extent, protect the fire to an extent ... but most of them are not air tight ... if we were to submerge the safe into water, water does go in ... the seals give way ...

And to invest in a high grade safe would cost to much ...

Even the safes / lockers in Most Indian Banks or Independent Valut services are not air tight ... but yes they do have a larger fire and flood control mechanism ...
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Offline Coinsforever

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Re: Fire proof safes for coin collection
« Reply #11 on: November 26, 2012, 06:47:02 AM »
You need to choose there are many options which suits your requirement.

Refer this website. even you can watch fire test videos uploaded at you tube by this company.


Cheers ;D
Every experience, good or bad, is a priceless collector's item.



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paisepagal

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Re: Fire proof safes for coin collection
« Reply #12 on: November 26, 2012, 07:05:56 AM »
thnx ajay...the 1st safe in the link you provided looks ideal to store my albums...though the price is a bi hard to swallow...I think Godrej will definitely have a similar model and with my fingers crossed, at a much lower price !

Offline malj1

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Re: Fire proof safes for coin collection
« Reply #13 on: November 26, 2012, 07:30:47 AM »
On air-tight issues and implicitly moisture....that's why I talked about the dehumidifier before.... though flooding is not a concern for me thankfully  :)

Flooding is not a concern for me either I live on a mountain top at 1620 feet.

Thief resistant is important, my collection was once stolen but I got back 95% of it.
Malcolm
Have a look at  my tokens and my banknotes.

Offline dheer

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Re: Fire proof safes for coin collection
« Reply #14 on: November 26, 2012, 07:49:38 AM »
Flooding is not a concern for me either I live on a mountain top at 1620 feet.

Thief resistant is important, my collection was once stolen but I got back 95% of it.

I always thought theft would be problem for dealers and other and not for us ... knowing that a member had theft makes me worry now ... lucky you got your stuff back ..
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