PART 2: MY ANALYSIS OF THE 1939 INDIA ONE RUPEE COIN (last revision 06/26/2012)

Started by cranko, December 05, 2012, 06:02:54 AM

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cranko

Thanks for reading the story, and many others contributed as well.

Sincerely,

Sanjay

vajjran

Thanks for the various informations.  They are very useful for any enthusiast.

Would it be possible to putup or refer to an image of the 1939 Calcutta Mint One Rupee please.

As per KM# 554 it is a Proof [KM# 554 RUPEE - 1939(c) Proof].

May be it did not have the Bombay Mint's dots. But on the Reverse how are letterings? Are there "." (dots) and ~ before and after the date, denomination, etc.  Or is it similar to KM# 524 Rev.?

I'll be thankful for any information on this.

cranko

Thanks for the feedback, and i'm glad you find the info useful. I have never seen a 1939 Proof, and I don't know if it exists or not. You may want to check around on the web for an image. Thanks. Sincerely, Sanjay

Roxburgh

There is an interesting comment in an article by F. Pridmore titled "NOTES ON COLONIAL COINS". In that article he states that "Under a Government of India Finance Department Notitification
No. D-7340 F dated 29th October, 1938, it was ordered that all coins struck in the Indian mints on and after the 1st November 1938, would bear the effigy of King George VI. No coins bearing the effigy of
King George V were struck after the 31st October, 1938.

This implies that coins with the name and effigy of George V dated 1936 may well have been struck as late as the end of October 1938.

This shouldn't surprise as coins with the effigy of King George IV dated 1835 were struck as such until 1840. The coins of Victoria dated 1840 and 1862 continued to be struck for many years.

The Pridmore article can be viewed on-line at: http://www.britnumsoc.org/publications/Digital%20BNJ/pdfs/1968_BNJ_37_19.pdf

cranko

Thanks for sharing the information with us, and your thoughts. I always suspected that the 1936 India denominations were "frozen" strikes or years. There are so many of them available in great quantities, there were no circulating coins dated 1937, and as you pointed out that most of these coins were not struck until after the order was noted. Similarly Pridmore does mention that a small quantity of 1938 coins were struck in late 1939. 1835 very well was frozen I suspect but only up until mid 1837 when William passed, and 1840 Divided Legend was struck in mass quantity probably up until 1862. 1840 Continuous Rupees I'm not so certain about as they are more difficult to find than Divided. I am starting to believe they stopped making them in 1850-51 or so when the Divideds were first struck. Makes sense to me, thanks, and regards-

cranko


Figleaf

While actual production periods are certainly important, it is also important to consider distribution. Keeping in mind the issue of paper rupees, it is likely that the authorities had an adequate supply of (mostly 1938 dated) rupees. Indian preference for silver coins would mean that people would not have surrendered rupee coins to the banks and would have hoarded them instead, while banks would have distributed mostly paper. That is a recipe for months worth of rupee coins in stock, fed ultimately with 1939 dated rupees. The already issued coins served as private reserves or were used for religious purposes or weddings and the notes were used for circulation.

Almost all 1939 rupees would have remained in stock, with only some distributed by the baksheesh system. However, few people would have cared about the date. When new orders arrived to stop issuing silver coins (there may be a connection between the order and the lend-lease act of March 1941; the Dutch government stopped minting silver to be able to pay the US), the silver coins in stock would generally no longer be issued. They may have been kept in stock for years, due to civil servants' inertia - providing another chance for coin leakage, but they were ultimately re-melted.

Peter
An unidentified coin is a piece of metal. An identified coin is a piece of history.

cranko

1940 One Rupee notes were issued in quantity of 90,000,000, and counted as silver coin. The total mintage for the 1940 One Rupee coin is 150,000,000 according to Krause. In actuality it's 60,000,000 coins or less. 1941's mintage may be even less than listed as well, and from experience 1940 and 1941 are almost impossible to find in Gem BU grades.
1943 is equally tough or tougher, and the 1943 mintage is completely erroneous as well.

1944 was the height of World War II, and the mints probably stopped minted 1943 dated which were more than likely struck in 1944. This was common practice as the fiscal year overlaps into the next year. Hence minting into the next year, what I describe for 1939 is that it may have started, and stopped almost immediately. Why I don't believe it was fully struck is because it has the identical mintage to the 1911 1/2 Rupee, but one will find those in either complete crap grade or Gem BU. Someone pulled a few of those out of the mint, and knew the scarcity. People were well aware of scarcity, and I don't really think anyone had time to pull a few pieces of the 1939 Rupee. The decisions must have been made so quick, and I think they just stopped after a very short stint of minting. Whatever was mixed in with the 1938 bags or rolls is what got distributed, and that was just by chance.

The 1911 1/2 Rupee mintage I believe was struck fully, stored, more than 1939, and not distributed. The 1939 Rupee mintage struck in it's entirety?

I am not a buyer-

Someone specifically at the mint pulled out over 15 BU/GEM examples of that date. You have a better shot at finding a bu/gem example than an AU example. Can the same be said for the 1939 Rupee date? No. Ask the collectors or view the population reports. Both can confirm the above speculative info. The thought of debasing the silver Rupee was done months before it was to be actually done, and it was a last minute decision I believe. There wasn't anything to melt, and whatever escaped from the mint was probably mixed in with the 1938 Rupee bags or rolls.

I am still convinced the mint kept the same obverse working die from 1938 dated Rupee, and replaced only the reverse. The 1939 dated Rupee reverse is off by a few degrees to the left almost identically as the 1938 dated Rupee reverse. They were in a hurry. In addition there is no "test diamond mark" behind George's head which is usually indicative of a new die. Those diamonds were used to measure die wear. But. I have never seen a full diamond behind the head of George on a 1939 dated Rupee.

What's very fascinating to me is that the "Reverse" has a fully visible test strike as I have described in the article-


The decision to come off the .917 silver standard for the Rupee was a rash decision, and wasn't supposed to happen until later in the year for the Rupee. The mints had already made a decision as mentioned in the full article. The mint struck the Security Edge 1939 Rupee, and completely abandoned the 1939 .500 silver debased striking. Why? Because they were probably well into the year to start striking 1940 dated coins. This is what I believe. In addition to what I believe, they could not get the Security Edge application correct. The British Government had to fly people out a few times to properly calibrate the edge, and that was after this striking I think. They still didn't get it right.

Anyways, collectors will find 1942,1944, 1945, and 1938 Rupees by the boatloads. 1938 was hoarded for sure, and the debased issues were struck in gargantuan quantities. Try to find 1940, 1941, and 1943 in Gem Bu condition. Good Luck. I'm still looking. But collectors are brainwashed by 1938 for some reason that it is "scarce".

During the debasement The Pittman Act money was due as well after the war. Someone can research when the Pittman Act repayment was actually due, and I'm fairly certain it was in the 1940's. The Indian British Government starting debasing silver with the 1939 Rupee issue as the 1939 Security Edge Trial indicates. That issue was .500 silver, and not the fineness of .917 as the original issue 1939 Dated issue.

They had to return $270,000,000 to the good ole USA via The Pittman Act that they borrowed 20+ years ago-

Where should they take the money out from? The British Treasuries? Nope-

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm-

Debase the Rupee, and send the silver back to the UK. There was political unrest, and the British Government knew their time was up sooner or later, and they started operation : Debase

Inject half the silver in the form of coin, and flood the People with the "frozen" year 1940 One Rupee Paper notes which were not even close to par in lieu of  the hard asset of silver in terms of value.

But they pulled it off-

Very quietly-

From 1940 to 1946 can one imagine how much silver was sent to England via the Reserve Bank?

and then India gets it's Independence shortly thereafter-

think they cared about silver?

or freedom?

thoughts? 

Sanjay

unnut


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