Author Topic: "Medal coin" defined  (Read 7910 times)

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BC Numismatics

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"Medal coin" defined
« on: October 09, 2009, 11:35:58 PM »
Here's a section where we can discuss about the world's coin & medal-coin issues that commemorate the Millennium.

So far we have these ones;

Andorra 2000 1 Centim.
Chatham Islands 2001 $5.
Chatham Islands 2001 $50.
Great Britain 2000 5 Pounds.
Ireland 2000 1 Pound.
Kiribati & Western Samoa joint issue 1997 $1 & 1 Tala.
Namibia 2000 5 Cents.
New Zealand 2000 $10 medal-coin (actually issued in late 1999).
Tonga 1999 1 Pa'anga.
Turks & Caicos Islands 2000 25 Crowns (silver with gold-plated reverse & edge) - unlisted in Krause.
Western Samoa 2000 2 Sene.

Any others?

Aidan.
« Last Edit: September 02, 2018, 02:35:37 PM by Figleaf »

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Re: World Millennium coins
« Reply #1 on: October 09, 2009, 11:51:18 PM »
Aidan.

There is no 'Great Britain 2000 5 Pounds.'

There is however a United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland (to give the full title) 5 coin dated 1999 - 2000.   Is this the one that you mean?

Oh, using the word 'mean' reminds me, what do you mean by 'medal-coin', please?

Bill.
« Last Edit: October 10, 2009, 12:00:13 AM by bilnic »
Ilford, Essex, near London, England.

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Re: World Millennium coins
« Reply #2 on: October 10, 2009, 12:03:44 AM »
I forgot to mention that Singapore put out a bimetallic $5 commemorative for the Millennium.

Whether that circulated is debateable.

Taiwan also put out a Millennium commemorative as well.

Aidan.

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Re: World Millennium coins
« Reply #3 on: October 10, 2009, 12:13:34 AM »
It took me a few years to realise.. but the 5 Pound coin Bill mentions has 1999 and 2000 on reverse and the date on the obverse can be either 1999 or 2000 - there are many of each date.

Aidan's strange phrase is obviously, these days, just used in a few parts of New Zealand. No one has been able to point us to any recent use in printed numsmatics publications/press.

The Turks and Caicos coin in the list at the start of this topic is listed in the Schon catalogue as S-224. Turks and Caicos is typical of the places that SCWC sometimes fails to keep up with.

The Andorra 1 Centim does not exist for 2000 - unless anyone can find an image. There is a 1999 date 1 Centim.

The Andorra 1 Centim 1999, Namibia 5 Cents 2000 (and 1999 dated piece of the same type) and the Samoa 2 Sene 2000 (and 1999 dated piece of the same type) are all listed in SCWC (2009 and 2010 editions and likely some earlier editions) and in the recent Schon catalogues. The only theme for any of these is XXI Century Food Security. Aidan said he could not find some of these 1999 dated pieces in his books - I am not sure which he has.

Even without coins that should not be included - if done properly a list of millennium coins could number over 100 different pieces.... I won't bother to add any.

Thanks Mr Paul Baker

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Re: World Millennium coins
« Reply #4 on: October 10, 2009, 12:33:13 AM »
It took me a few years to realise.. but the 5 Pound coin Bill mentions has 1999 and 2000 on reverse and the date on the obverse can be either 1999 or 2000 - there are many of each date.
... ...
Aidan's strange phrase is obviously, these days, just used in a few parts of New Zealand. No one has been able to point us to any recent use in printed numsmatics publications/press.

Thanks for that.   I wasn't aware that there are both 1999 and 2000 coins, although there are also some with a Millennium Dome mintmark, which I now believe to be dated 2000 on the obverse.

Previous to joining this group, I was a 'lone collector' getting my information as best I could.   As a comparative newcomer to the scene, when I come across a term that I do not understand, I ask for more information.   But as no information is available from source, like Mr. Baker I must assume that it is either a term only used only in a very small area, or else it is slang.   I hope that it is not a term of abuse, which should definately not be allowed here.   But I would still like to know what it means.

Bill.
Ilford, Essex, near London, England.

People look for problems and complain.   Engineers find solutions but people still complain.

Offline africancoins

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Re: World Millennium coins
« Reply #5 on: October 10, 2009, 12:40:40 AM »
Bill,
   Aidan's term is one I never use. He seems to insist using it though it is out of date (and perhaps never has been widely used in England by collectors of our coins). Generally it means coins not intended for circulation.

Thanks Mr Paul Baker

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Re: World Millennium coins
« Reply #6 on: October 10, 2009, 12:53:17 AM »
Paul,
  I'm not the only one over here that uses the term 'Medal-coin'.

Martin is another one who also uses that term himself.

The Krugerrand is a classic case of a medal-coin.

Canada did put out gold Maple Leaves with a Millennium commemorative privy mark.

Jersey's gold 1 Sovereign can also be classed as a Millennium medal-coin as well.

Aidan.

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Re: World Millennium coins
« Reply #7 on: October 10, 2009, 01:02:18 AM »
Thank you, Paul.

I agree with you in that it seems like that, but Aidan has previously said that (quote)"If it is sold at the face value,then it automatically loses the status of being a medal-coin for this reason."(unquote) in a post dated 08 October 2009, 04:27:04.

About ten hours after that, I suggested (quote)"If I am reading your posts correctly, you would also class almost any coin that is sold by a dealer as a medal-coin because it is sold at over face value, that is why I am asking you to give your exact definition."(unquote)

I think that you can see why I am perplexed.

Bill.





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Re: World Millennium coins
« Reply #8 on: October 10, 2009, 01:13:06 AM »
Paul,
  I'm not the only one over here that uses the term 'Medal-coin'.

Martin is another one who also uses that term himself.

The Krugerrand is a classic case of a medal-coin.

Canada did put out gold Maple Leaves with a Millennium commemorative privy mark.

Jersey's gold 1 Sovereign can also be classed as a Millennium medal-coin as well.

Aidan.

Aha!   I think that we may be getting somewhere at last!

Would I be correct, then, in saying that a 'medal-coin' is a coin of a type usually struck in base metal but for the occasion it has been struck in a rare metal?   That would tie it in with what I class as 'jewellery or bullion'.

Bill.
Ilford, Essex, near London, England.

People look for problems and complain.   Engineers find solutions but people still complain.

translateltd

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Re: World Millennium coins
« Reply #9 on: October 10, 2009, 03:57:07 AM »
Aha!   I think that we may be getting somewhere at last!

Would I be correct, then, in saying that a 'medal-coin' is a coin of a type usually struck in base metal but for the occasion it has been struck in a rare metal?   That would tie it in with what I class as 'jewellery or bullion'.

Bill.

I think we're at risk of analysing too much here.  What you are describing are known as "off-metal strikes".

The basic concept of Aidan's "medal-coin" refers to what is essentially a commemorative medallion in function, but happens to carry indications that make it look like a coin (a denomination - usually fictitious - and a country name or royal portrait, etc.) even though it was not intended for use as an actual circulating coin. 

While I haven't used the term myself in a while, I don't really find it objectionable, simply because the emphasis is on the medallic nature of the beast, whereas "NCLT" implies the objects are still coins, which is debatable (and a debate that I have no wish to open up again here!)  My preferred descriptor is actually "denomination-bearing medals".  Design a commemorative medal, whack a denomination and some reference to authority on it, and lo! You have a "coin" that you can sell for way more than the secondary market is usually ever likely to support, and one that has no useful purpose other than decoration.

One thing that may be worth thinking about is that early collectors (I'm talking pre-20th century here) often referred to Classical coins - the larger ones in particular - as medals; I don't know the exact origin of this usage, but wouldn't be surprised if it was because of their fine artwork and high relief, which would more closely have resembled the fabric of Renaissance medals than the coins that were being used at the time.  Irrelevant to the main discussion of course, but an interesting alternative use of the term, all the same.


BC Numismatics

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Re: World Millennium coins
« Reply #10 on: October 10, 2009, 04:15:39 AM »
Martin,
  Can you think of any more countries that have commemorated the Millennium with at least 1 coin or medal-coin?

I think that the Isle of Man had a Millennium series struck for it by the Pobjoy Mint,as did Sierra Leone.

I know that Liberia had at least 1.

Aidan.

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Re: World Millennium coins
« Reply #11 on: October 10, 2009, 10:11:12 AM »
Martin,

Thank you for explaining 'medal-coins' to me.   I understand now that they are commemorative medallions with a questionable monetary value shown on them and that they are not some form of any proper coin.   Perhaps part of this topic should be moved away from the heading 'coin collecting' to avoid confusion with proper coins.

I have also learnt that the UK 5 Millennium coin has two different obverses, one showing the year as 1999 and the other 2000.   That is something that I did not know.   I believe that the ones with the Dome mintmark are some of the 2000 version but I am open to correction on this.   That would make three versions of the coin.

Bill. 
« Last Edit: October 10, 2009, 10:19:11 AM by bilnic »
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Re: World Millennium coins
« Reply #12 on: December 08, 2009, 08:01:39 PM »
I picked up a Manx Millennium-related circulating commemorative coin on Sunday afternoon - the 2002PM AA 1 Pound depicting the Triskeles & 3 bells on the reverse.

It is inscribed 'MILLENNIUM BELLS'.

Aidan.