Author Topic: Comments on "Portraits of African Leaders"  (Read 9237 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline <k>

  • Moderator
  • Honorary Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 19 857
Comments on "Portraits of African Leaders"
« on: February 10, 2012, 10:07:17 PM »
Parent topic:  Portraits of African Leaders


The parent topic (above) presents a series of numismatic portraits of political leaders from sub-Saharan Africa. Please post any comments, questions or corrections here.
« Last Edit: November 25, 2013, 06:15:27 PM by <k> »

Offline kena

  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 440
  • UK-Yank
Re: Comments on "Portraits of African Leaders"
« Reply #1 on: February 10, 2012, 10:50:46 PM »
The former president of Namibia - Sam Nujoma is on the 2010 $10 coin from there.

I can provide pictures of the coin if needed.

Ken

Offline <k>

  • Moderator
  • Honorary Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 19 857
Re: Comments on "Portraits of African Leaders"
« Reply #2 on: February 10, 2012, 10:54:14 PM »
Thanks, Ken. You can either post them here, and I'll link to them when I get there (could take a couple of evenings yet!), or else PM me with your preferred method.

Offline kena

  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 440
  • UK-Yank
Re: Comments on "Portraits of African Leaders"
« Reply #3 on: February 10, 2012, 10:58:06 PM »
Here are pics of the coins.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sam_Nujoma for information about Sam.

Ken

Offline <k>

  • Moderator
  • Honorary Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 19 857
Re: Comments on "Portraits of African Leaders"
« Reply #4 on: February 10, 2012, 11:07:54 PM »
Thanks, Ken - very nice images.  ;)  8)

translateltd

  • Guest
Re: Comments on "Portraits of African Leaders"
« Reply #5 on: February 11, 2012, 09:15:50 PM »
Seeing Daniel Arap Moi reminds me of a headline in the Spectator a number of years ago, "L'Etat, c'est Moi".


Offline <k>

  • Moderator
  • Honorary Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 19 857
Re: Comments on "Portraits of African Leaders"
« Reply #6 on: February 11, 2012, 09:24:03 PM »
He's still alive - I'll tell him that.  ;D

Offline Figleaf

  • Administrator
  • Honorary Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 28 585
Re: Comments on "Portraits of African Leaders"
« Reply #7 on: February 12, 2012, 01:44:09 AM »
Don't forget the kings of Morocco. They and the negus can claim the right of royalty to be on coins. Egypt's Nasser appeared on pseudo coins, though not during his lie if I remember correctly.

Peter
An unidentified coin is a piece of metal. An identified coin is a piece of history.

Offline <k>

  • Moderator
  • Honorary Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 19 857
Re: Comments on "Portraits of African Leaders"
« Reply #8 on: February 12, 2012, 01:49:58 AM »
Well, our boards are divided into North Africa and Sub-Saharan Africa, so I intend to exclude the North Africans and maybe do a separate topic for them, but including also the Middle East.

Still not sure whether I should restrict THIS topic to black Africans. Maybe at the end I will include Mauritius, Seychelles, and the Afrikaner presidents of South Africa.

Offline kena

  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 440
  • UK-Yank
Re: Comments on "Portraits of African Leaders"
« Reply #9 on: February 12, 2012, 08:59:56 AM »
May I ask why you are thinking about restricting this just "black" Africans?

For example, if you do that, then you ignore the country of Zuid-Afrikaansche Republiek and Stephanus Johannes Paulus Kruger who appeared on ZAR coins as well as the Krugerrand.

I can understand not including coins from countries which had British Monarchs on them.

Ken

Offline Figleaf

  • Administrator
  • Honorary Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 28 585
Re: Comments on "Portraits of African Leaders"
« Reply #10 on: February 12, 2012, 12:57:33 PM »
Well, our boards are divided into North Africa and Sub-Saharan Africa, so I intend to exclude the North Africans and maybe do a separate topic for them, but including also the Middle East.

Brilliant. Looking forward.

Still not sure whether I should restrict THIS topic to black Africans. Maybe at the end I will include Mauritius, Seychelles, and the Afrikaner presidents of South Africa.

You show three classes of leaders  and therefore create a fourth class: those pictured on coins while in office, otherwise known - with the exception of royalty - as "tin pot dictators" (thanks, Ms. Thatcher), those pictured while alive and those pictured while being dead. The fourth class is leaders not on coins. That division transcends race, so I would argue the non-blacks fully belong in the thread. You might even consider splitting the thread thusly. It would be interesting to see where freedom-fighters/terrorists/first presidents/heroes-of-independence come in. I am still wondering about the suitability of agitators (in the most neutral sense of the word) to be administrators (also meant neutrally) and vice versa.

Peter
An unidentified coin is a piece of metal. An identified coin is a piece of history.

Offline <k>

  • Moderator
  • Honorary Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 19 857
Re: Comments on "Portraits of African Leaders"
« Reply #11 on: February 12, 2012, 02:24:12 PM »
May I ask why you are thinking about restricting this just "black" Africans?

For example, if you do that, then you ignore the country of Zuid-Afrikaansche Republiek and Stephanus Johannes Paulus Kruger who appeared on ZAR coins as well as the Krugerrand.

I can understand not including coins from countries which had British Monarchs on them.

Ken

The topic title includes the phrase "African leaders". I asked myself how I should define "African": ethnically only, or geographically, because if you are born in Africa, as say an Afrikaner, that makes you African too in a sense. So I will probably group the ethnic Africans together then finish off with those of Asian, mixed, and European descent.

Offline <k>

  • Moderator
  • Honorary Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 19 857
Re: Comments on "Portraits of African Leaders"
« Reply #12 on: February 12, 2012, 03:10:23 PM »
I have just reordered the posts of the topic, so that the countries now appear in alphabetical order (though I have logically included Zaire with Congo DR). As I was progressing yesterday, I was looking only at countries with circulation coins but was surprised to find that a few countries had issued portraits only on gold and silver collector pieces. This reminds me that a couple of the so called "homelands" of apartheid South Africa also produced portrait pieces (Bophuphatswana, for one), but I may not be successful in finding those, so any help would be appreciated.  ;)

Offline <k>

  • Moderator
  • Honorary Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 19 857
Re: Comments on "Portraits of African Leaders"
« Reply #13 on: February 12, 2012, 04:21:50 PM »
and those pictured while dead.

Peter

That is the only class I am leaving out. Maybe someone else could do a topic on those.  ;)

It would be interesting to see where freedom-fighters/terrorists/first presidents/heroes-of-independence come in. I am still wondering about the suitability of agitators (in the most neutral sense of the word) to be administrators (also meant neutrally) and vice versa.

Sometimes it works, as seen in the case of Mandela, who was a great conciliator (and way over in Northern Ireland, also in the case of Martin McGuinness of Sinn Fein, also a great conciliator, but he is not relevant to this topic). However, reading the Wikipedia pieces on several of the other African leaders has reminded me of nothing so much as ancient Rome, with its treachery, infamy, turmoil and assassinations. There are of course good reasons for that, given the way black Africa was first enslaved and then dumped, largely unprepared, into the modern world.

Offline chrisild

  • Honorary Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8 353
  • NW DE EU
Re: Comments on "Portraits of African Leaders"
« Reply #14 on: February 15, 2012, 12:02:37 AM »
This reminds me that a couple of the so called "homelands" of apartheid South Africa also produced portrait pieces (Bophuphatswana, for one)

This is the one ... and I think it is the only one:
http://www.24carat.co.uk/frame.php?url=bophuthatswana.html

As far as I know, Bophuthatswana was the only "independent homeland" that issued "coins" at all. They had two collector pieces (gold, platinum) made in 1987, for the 10th anniversary of their, hmm, independence. The platinum piece depicts Lucas Mangope.

Christian