Author Topic: VOC duits  (Read 17667 times)

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Offline Overlord

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VOC duits
« on: February 07, 2008, 04:46:21 PM »
The only VOC Duit in my collection...




Any info on the mint?

Offline Oesho

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Re: Dutch East India Company (VOC): Copper Duit
« Reply #1 on: February 07, 2008, 05:52:19 PM »
This is a doit of the Utrecht type, with the date 1790 and star above the VOC monogram.
You may be surprised, but this coin was not struck in 1790, but from 1840 to 1843 at both Sourabaya and Batavia. The dies were imported from the Netherlands.
With the closing of the Mints at Surabaya and Batavia in 1843 the production of coins on Java came to an end.
« Last Edit: February 08, 2008, 11:21:02 PM by Oesho »

Offline Overlord

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Re: Dutch East India Company (VOC): Copper Duit
« Reply #2 on: February 08, 2008, 06:02:07 PM »
This is a doit of the Utrecht type, with the date 1790 and star above the VOC monogram.
You may be surprised, but this coin was struck in 1790, but from 1840 to 1843 at both Sourabaya and Batavia. The dies were imported from the Netherlands.
With the closing of the Mints at Surabaya and Batavia in 1843 the production of coins on Java came to an end.
Thanks Oesho!
I don't quite follow the second part. Did you mean the coin was not struck in 1790, but between 1840 and 1843 with the frozen date "1790".

Offline Oesho

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Re: Dutch East India Company (VOC): Copper Duit
« Reply #3 on: February 08, 2008, 11:20:35 PM »
Sorry I forgot "not"; it was not struck in 1790. I will correct in the text.

Offline Figleaf

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Re: Dutch East India Company (VOC): Copper Duit
« Reply #4 on: February 09, 2008, 06:47:27 PM »
One of the things retained from the French revolution was the decimal system. It was introduced in the Dutch East Indies by royal decree of 8th november 1815. However, this was wishful thinking, as Raffles blithely disobeyed orders and kept the area occupied. As he was finally kicked out of his last hold-out, Bencoolen, in 1824, the decision to decimalize the islands was reiterated by royal decree of 18th February 1826. However, there was only a half-hearted attempt to provide decimal silver and the copper coins continued to be denominated in terms of the non-decimal stuiver and duit.

As before the Napoleonic wars, there was a great scarcity of copper coins. Therefore copper duits were re-struck, first at the Utrecht Mint (KM 111.2), later in Java (KM111.3). In order to avoid legal problems, they were similar to the VOC duits (the VOC had been declared insolvent and was taken over by the Dutch state) and dated with the frozen year 1790.

New coppers were inscribed 5 - 1/16 - G, presumably meaning that there were 80 duits to the Dutch silver gulden. The locals happily ignored this, as there was little or no silver in circulation. From 1833, decimal 1 and 2 cent pieces were introduced and ... used as 1 and 2 duit pieces. Meanwhile, the scarcity of copper continued, mainly because the Dutch silver coins were slightly undervalued against copper. Therefore, local mints were opened again to strike Utrecht duits (KM 111.4). Your coin is one of those.

The colonial monetary system was completely reformed by law of 1st May 1854. Old copper and paper money was withdrawn, new, lighter and much better struck coins introduced alongside regular Dutch coin. It had taken 51 years from the surrender at Waterloo too introduce the decimal system in the Netherlands East Indies. The reformed system was basically in effect (with some marginal tinkering) until the second world war and the end of the colonial era.

Peter
« Last Edit: March 14, 2008, 06:53:53 PM by Figleaf »
An unidentified coin is a piece of metal. An identified coin is a piece of history.

Offline Overlord

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Re: Dutch East India Company (VOC): Copper Duit
« Reply #5 on: February 16, 2008, 06:12:17 AM »
Thanks for the info, Peter.

Offline Overlord

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VOC duits
« Reply #6 on: March 14, 2008, 05:47:36 PM »
I now have another...




Offline Figleaf

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Re: VOC duits
« Reply #7 on: March 14, 2008, 07:12:28 PM »
This one has a much less colourful history. It was struck in 1746, at the Dordrecht mint (mintmark: 5-petalled rose). The VOC at this time was almost a state within a state. It is credited with inventing equity shares (they look more like bonds to me), they could negotiate on equal terms with sovereign powers, maintain their own army and navy and issue their own money (provided that it was minted in Dutch mints and could be easiliy distingished from regular Dutch coins.

Life on board VOC ships was relatively good. The ships sailed in well armed convoys and there were replenishing points all along the route to the Indies, so the hands could have fresh water and vegetables. Payment was low and due only on arrival or on return in the Netherlands. Smuggling by officers to increase income was tolerated because it kept wages low. Silver coins and bars were very popular articles for smuggling as the relative price of silver was higher in Asia than in Europe. Smuggled silver of all officers would be kept in the captain's quarters, in the captain's case. This case was supposed to contain the captain's private affairs and therefore considered the very last place that could be inspected.

Though smuggling by crew was not tolerated, it did happen. On arrival, copper VOC coins would be contraband. Crew with a few loose coppers left threw them into the water in the port of Amsterdam. Maybe young boys dived after them. When the first Amsterdam underground line was constructed (the terminal is under the Central Station, once the waterfront of the port), the price of VOC coppers suddenly collapsed ;). Even today, detectorists will find VOC coppers around the port of Amsterdam, but also other reminders of the once mighty VOC. One of the most spectacular pieces I have seen was an identification medal for a member of the VOC's own fire brigade.

Peter
« Last Edit: March 16, 2008, 05:25:33 PM by Figleaf »
An unidentified coin is a piece of metal. An identified coin is a piece of history.

Offline Rangnath

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Re: VOC duits
« Reply #8 on: March 14, 2008, 08:51:31 PM »
This one has a much less colourful history. It was struck in 1746, at the Dordrecht mint (mintmark: 5-petalled rose). The VOC at this time was almost a state within a state. It is credited with inventing equity shares (they look more like bonds to me), they could negotiate on equal terms with sovereign powers, maintain their own army and navy and issue their own money (provided that it was minted in Dutch mints and could be easiliy distingished from regular Dutch coins.

 Maybe Cheney and Bush are using the same model for Haliburton!  >:D
richie
« Last Edit: March 14, 2008, 10:53:43 PM by Figleaf »

Offline Overlord

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Re: VOC duits
« Reply #9 on: March 16, 2008, 04:50:31 PM »
Peter, thanks a lot for the info. I learn something new almost every day at this forum.

Offline Overlord

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Re: VOC duits
« Reply #10 on: May 11, 2008, 11:08:17 AM »
Another duit, probably of the same type as above.




Offline Overlord

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Re: VOC duits
« Reply #11 on: May 11, 2008, 11:09:00 AM »



Offline Figleaf

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Re: VOC duits
« Reply #12 on: May 11, 2008, 11:35:02 AM »
The date is 1735, otherwise it is the same type. Duits were struck at other Dutch mints also. Look for different coat of arms.

Incidentally, the arms give you a good clue of the difference between Holland and the Netherlands. These are the Holland arms. Note the absence of the crown on the lion's head and sword as well as the blocks in the field. These arms were used by the counts of Holland.

A climbing lion was a very popular heraldic device in the north-west of the German empire, so the counts of Nassau put a semee of blocks in their arms. The crown and sword came later.

Peter
« Last Edit: May 11, 2008, 12:11:39 PM by Figleaf »
An unidentified coin is a piece of metal. An identified coin is a piece of history.

Offline a3v1

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Re: VOC duits
« Reply #13 on: May 11, 2008, 04:33:31 PM »
This duit was struck at the Westfrisian Mint; in the 1730's located in Enkhuizen.
The mintmaster was Jan Knol and his privy mark is a knol (turnip).
Regards,
a3v1
Over half a century of experience as a coin collector.
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Offline Rangnath

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Re: VOC duits
« Reply #14 on: May 12, 2008, 06:02:06 PM »
A3v1,
I am curious about the selection of the knol as a privy mark.  Do you know why?

In the 1950's through the 1970's in the US, the turnip had a bad reputation, at least in the Northeast of the nation.  One of the cheapest of vegtables, I think that it was considered a "Poor" man's food, suitable for slop, the food of pigs. The greens, even when the turnip was purchased, was generally discarded. 
For a classless society, we can be pretty snobish. But still, I don't think anyone in the USA but a hurmorist would think of using it as a symbol on a coin.
richie