Author Topic: Young Indians Buy Old Coins as Investment  (Read 22159 times)

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Offline Coinsforever

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Re: Young Indians Buy Old Coins as Investment
« Reply #15 on: February 02, 2015, 05:01:35 PM »
Another story... ::)

Many sides of the coin

 The idea is for transparency

(This article was published on January 31, 2015)

Source: The Hindu

 8) 8) 8) 8)

Such stories are created by reporters who have zero idea of numismatics /coin collecting.


Cheers ;D
Every experience, good or bad, is a priceless collector's item.



http://knowledge-numismatics.blogspot.in/

Offline Quant.Geek

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Re: Young Indians Buy Old Coins as Investment
« Reply #16 on: February 02, 2015, 05:51:45 PM »
The problem here is India is trying to become more and more westernized, but sometimes trips on itself in the process  ::).  A hobby is not about making money, as it is a form of enjoyment and hence is equivalent to taking a vacation.  You are investing in time well spent and hence is not about making an investment.  Investing in coins is usually a poor investment strategy unless you are going for very large ticket items that shows a continuous trend of interest, otherwise you are bound to loose some money.  The "pleasure without monetary gain" seems to be missing in the Indian dictionary...
« Last Edit: February 02, 2015, 06:47:21 PM by Quant.Geek »
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Online Figleaf

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Re: Young Indians Buy Old Coins as Investment
« Reply #17 on: February 02, 2015, 08:04:25 PM »
You may be a little too hard there, QG. Yes, it happens too often in India, but we have a pretty large population of Indian good guys here, a sure indication that there are more like them out there. We have a mission of education and in that respect, your approach of research and rigorous description is exemplary.

Monetising the hobby is not typically Indian. A good part of the reason I have an intense dislike of slabbing is that it is all about money and "investments" and hampers research. It makes people unwilling to do the research themselves and too trusting. The whole idea that a coin is worth more when it is slabbed is dead wrong. The idea that it is "guaranteed" to be as described and not a fake or overgraded is just as wrong. These ideas are all not originally Indian, but they are sold to Indians for good money. Reverse development aid.

Peter
An unidentified coin is a piece of metal. An identified coin is a piece of history.

Offline Quant.Geek

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Re: Young Indians Buy Old Coins as Investment
« Reply #18 on: February 02, 2015, 09:35:20 PM »
You may be a little too hard there, QG. Yes, it happens too often in India, but we have a pretty large population of Indian good guys here, a sure indication that there are more like them out there. We have a mission of education and in that respect, your approach of research and rigorous description is exemplary.

Monetising the hobby is not typically Indian. A good part of the reason I have an intense dislike of slabbing is that it is all about money and "investments" and hampers research. It makes people unwilling to do the research themselves and too trusting. The whole idea that a coin is worth more when it is slabbed is dead wrong. The idea that it is "guaranteed" to be as described and not a fake or overgraded is just as wrong. These ideas are all not originally Indian, but they are sold to Indians for good money. Reverse development aid.

Peter

Of course there are exceptions to the rule and there are several great members who truly know what a hobby is and are very passionate about numismatics.  And of course monetizing a hobby is not an Indian philosophy, but there is a fundamental cultural problem here that should be addressed.  I can guarantee you that if the Indian numismatics market wasn't hot right now, there would be A LOT of people who wouldn't be collecting at all.  And that is my problem here.   "pleasure without monetary gain" doesn't really exist in a lot of cases in India.  There needs to be a valid reason, and mostly monetary, in order to embark on any tasks otherwise it is deemed as a waste of time. Consider cmerc's signature which is a great line that is somewhat based on this philosophy:

Defending this hobby against disapproving family looks since 1998.
A gallery of my coins can been seen at FORVM Ancient Coins

Offline bgriff99

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Re: Young Indians Buy Old Coins as Investment
« Reply #19 on: February 03, 2015, 01:06:15 AM »
You can make it as existential as you like.   I have Chinese coins that came from large bulk lots dug from the ground in Indonesia.    Worked out date and mint sequences beyond what the reigning authorities, Werner Burger and Hartill have any clue about.   Thus rarities, and a collection which can no longer be duplicated because the coins are all dug out now and most melted for scrap metal.    If a rare coin is historically significant but you are the only one that recognizes it, or bothered to keep it, is it worth anything?   Alternately, if a rare specimen coin is well known and bid up astronomically by fanciers of specimen coins, is THAT worth pursuing?

The arc of collecting takes many of us into specialization, research and publishing.   That requires a certain degree of contrariness and not running with the 'monetizers'.

Offline Bimat

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Young Indians Buy Old Coins as Investment
« Reply #20 on: February 01, 2016, 05:16:27 AM »
Coins gain currency as investment

Updated: February 1, 2016 05:45 IST
SARATH BABU GEORGE

Collecting currency notes, coins, and postage stamps was once a fad among the young and old. Over the past decade, the hobby has slowly transformed into an investment opportunity.

In the process, a certain amount of competitiveness has crept in. Many numismatists who spoke to The Hindu on the sidelines of the 26th annual conference of the South Indian Numismatics Society, which concluded here on Sunday, agreed.

“I belong to a time when each coin was considered precious, but was never intended to be resold for profits,” says Suresh Babu, a numismatist, who has been dealing in ancient coins for over two decades. Only those very keen on adding to their collection stuck to the hobby back then.

Now, many people, mostly youth, take to coin collection for quick profits. “There is no denying the huge investment potential. While we have lagged behind other countries in identifying the immense possibilities of coin collection, there are currently a handful of auction houses in India which deal in ancient coins and rare stamps,” says Sunil J. Joseph, a stockbroker and philatelist.

Unhealthy practices too have found their way in, with several fake products being offered as vintage collectibles.

The absence of a proper mechanism to fix prices for antiquities gives rise to over-valuation. According to professional numismatist and dealer K.T. Joseph, this continues to be a grey area in the field of coin and stamp collection. “For instance, there was no fool-proof method to identify several coins that are believed to have been in use before 1600 AD. In such cases, dealers usually fix rates on the basis of historical relevance and demand of the collectible,” he said.

In recent times, informal collectives of numismatists and philatelists have mushroomed with an aim of creating greater awareness among one another. One among them is the Facebook group, Indian Coin Collectors Club, which has over 8,000 members. According to Rajesh T.S. Nair, one of the administrators, the group comprises authors, historians and experts in the field. “We strive to generate knowledge regarding the negative practices that have evolved in the field,” Mr. Nair said.

Source: The Hindu

« Last Edit: February 01, 2016, 06:41:46 AM by Bimat »
It is our choices...that show what we truly are, far more than our abilities. -J. K. Rowling.

Offline Bimat

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Young Indians Buy Old Coins as Investment
« Reply #21 on: May 21, 2016, 07:53:28 AM »
The hype continues... ::) Are these newspapers 'Paid' to print articles like this?

Rare and antique coins become new investment as their prices surge

By Shailesh Menon, ET Bureau | 21 May, 2016, 05.30AM IST

MUMBAI: Kishore Jhunjhunwalla, 73, had to wait nearly four decades before he could lay his hands on a British India 'twin-currency coin,' specially minted to pay World War II soldiers of the allied forces. This King George VI coin was issued in two currencies— it was worth a US dollar and two-and-a-half Indian rupees at the same time — as it was meant to be given to both Indian and foreign soldiers.

"But soldiers did not accept these coins, it is assumed. The British were forced to take back these coins, and in a few years it became very rare piece among collectors," said Jhunjhunwalla, who has been a coin collector for more than six decades.

Jhunjhunwalla managed to get the prized coin in 1995, when he found a willing seller for Rs 50,000. Four years later, another collector persuaded Jhunjhunwalla to sell the coin for Rs 4 lakh. "You'll not get that coin now even if you pay Rs 60 lakh for it," he said a trifle wistfully.

While there is no official price reckoner for rare coins, Jhunjhunwalla may not be exaggerating the 15-fold increase in price of the twin-currency coin. Prices of rare and antique currencies, both coins and notes, have surged manifold over the past few years.

Take, for instance, a 1939 one-rupee silver coin, catalogued by numismatists as India's last 'pure silver' coin, which was traded among mid-range collectors for about Rs 7,000 per piece in 2007. That's now being sold at prices in excess of Rs 4 lakh. A British India Victoria Gold Mohur, carrying a price tag of Rs 35,000 in 2007, is being bid at auctions at over Rs 2 lakh. The price of a William IV Two Mohur set has zoomed to Rs 12 lakh from Rs 2 lakh eight years ago. And you don't need to go that far back: The once-ubiquitous one-rupee note, bearing the last series (print) date of 1994, is now being sold atRs 6-7 per piece. (See chart)

"It's a scarcity-driven business," said Girish Veera, owner of Oswal Auctions. "Collectors and coin auctions have gone up by a good measure since 2007. Higher demand for rare coins is driving up prices of rare coins."

A larger number of auctions is also among the reasons for this unprecedented rise in coin prices. According to top auctioneers, the first set of largescale coin auctions, held in 2007, witnessed a sale of over 2,500 rare coins. This has gone up to more than 25 auctions - selling over 30,000 rare coins - in 2015.

"We're finding more collectors now," said Farokh Todywalla of Todywalla Auctions, India's largest coin auctioneer by volume. "Earlier, there were a lot of government-imposed controls... gold control, excise control etc... Laws are friendlier now."

The auctions are well-attended by collectors and hobbyists, he said. "Over 2,000 patrons register to participate in our online auctions," Todywalla said. "In terms of sales, more coins are sold in the Rs 3,000 to Rs 20,000 price range. We also get high-value buyers for our gold mohurs and other special coins."

A collector bought a rare Mughal-era zodiacal mohur for more than Rs 1.4 crore at a Todywalla auction a few months ago. That buyer can typically expect to pay service tax, value added tax and a 'hammer commission' of about 10-12% to the auctioneer.

But it's not just the super rich who're into collecting currency. Some are not just collectors or hobbyists, they're looking for something that will appreciate in value over the years. "There are buyers across economic strata. There are also people who buy rare coins as an investment," said Rajenden Maru, CEO of Marudhar Arts, a Bangalore-based auctioneer. "Coin collection is the only hobby that pays back... If you keep good quality coins, you'll fetch good price for it 10-15 years later."

According to Bimal Trivedi, a numismatist at the online Mintage World museum , the rarity of a coin depends on many factors.

Coins issued by long-reigning emperors and in the name of women (Razia Sultan, Noorjehan, Naganika) are considered rare by collectors. Coins with unusual shapes, such as octagonal ones issued by Shahs of Malwa, and those issued in momentous years are also coveted by many. Top-grade antique coins (with deep-strike, on-centre imprints) command a value.

Supply is set to increase, said one expert as people take a look at possessions long forgotten.

"India has a long history of coins and currencies... There are coins locked in attics and old trunks of people, waiting to be found and identified," said Sushil Agarwal, CMD of Mintage World. "The supply of rare coins will increase once people realise the value of their holdings."

While collectors are hopeful of hitting richer treasure troves in the years to come, there are concerns over widespread circulation of forged coins and notes. New collectors are advised to exercise caution while buying rare coins on portals or through unregistered sellers. As the saying goes, a collector never finds a rare coin; it's always a rare coin that finds a good collector.

Source: Economic Times
« Last Edit: May 21, 2016, 01:12:11 PM by Bimat »
It is our choices...that show what we truly are, far more than our abilities. -J. K. Rowling.

Offline bgriff99

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Re: Young Indians Buy Old Coins as Investment
« Reply #22 on: May 21, 2016, 08:59:11 AM »
Like the United States around 1964-69.   The time to buy turned out to be 1983-88.... if you missed 1955.

Offline Pabitra

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Re: Young Indians Buy Old Coins as Investment
« Reply #23 on: May 21, 2016, 01:06:34 PM »
Not Payment.
Just entertain the correspondent with beer and fish and he will file an article like this.
Depending on the mood of editor, the article may go through without much editing.
Correspondent gets paid by column centimetre rate for final article which appears in print.