Lunavada, KM 10, paisa VS 1942 (1892 AD), overstrike

[Rangnath]

The coin offers less than complete detail, but still, what is there is intriguing. The image of the animal (a bull?) seems to be in motion, sort of like Duchamp?s  ?Nude descending a Staircase.?  It is rather beautiful.  The date at the bottom?  Is that  1747 and in what calendar?
I tried finding a coin with an image that reminded me of this one to no avail.  I?ll include a close up of the letters on the obverse.
richie

[Rangnath]

and the letters in higher contrast:

[Figleaf]

The expert strikes again: the copper coin is a paisa of the small Indian state of Lunavada, struck in the name of  Wakhat Singhji 1867-1929. On the obv. a lion going right, underneath a sword and the date in Vikrama Samvat 1949 (1892). Above the lion "Lunavada" in Gujerati. This is KM#10.

The rev, says in Gujarati "Ma Ra Sri"
                                    "Vaghat"
                                    "Singhji"

I am attaching the listing in KM so that you can see that there is indeed an unclothed lion on the coin, but no staircase in sight.

Peter

[Rangnath]

it was the double strike that lends itself to a cubist interpretation.

One of my neighbors is a Gujerati.  I can't wait to show her this coin. I had looked at Gujerati script in her house and remember thinking how different it is from Hindi.

richie

[Rangnath]

I have to include this and no offence to the people of Lunavada. It's to be sung to the Sri Ricky Martin hit of 1993.

Restrike up and restrike out we're livin la Luna Vada
They'll paisa you up and paisa you down, livin la Luna Vada
The chai made with jugry and buffalo milk, ahh
It'll wear you out livin la Luna Vada! Come On!
Livin la Luna Vada, Rupee!
We're livin la Luna Vada.

If you would like the rest of the Lyrics for a nominal charge of 5 euros, please contact me by private message.

[Figleaf]

A veritable poet at work. What a good voice you have, Richie. We're gonna have fun drinking that beer you promised me.

Peter

[Rangnath]

Thank you. Thank you. And Thank you.

[Salvete]

It's good to know that at least some coin experts have a sense of humour - sometimes one wonders.......
There is, however, a serious point to overstrikes of this kind.  Many 'crude' coppers are undated.  The order in which the various images have been struck and then overstruck are all the evidence that is available, sometimes, to tell us the order in which the dies were used.  This may be of only academic interest, but it might also assist with the history of a state or area.  I am thinking particularly of uniface coins struck at Bhilsa / Alamgirpur in the mid 19th century.
Salvete

[asm]

I recently picked up a 1/2 Paisa of this series (I had picked up the paisa a little earlier), it seems that both the values were struck from the same die with different sized blanks or was it that the Paisa was cut into two after it was struck? I will try to put up the picture of the 1/2 Paisa next week.

Amit

[Salvete]

Amit,
I have found the halves pretty hard to come by.  Well done on getting yours.
Salvete

[asm]

I agree. Most halves - whether rupee or paisa are hard to come by abd specially for these small states where the mintages would have been small they are indeed very difficult. This is the first Lunawada halh that I have ever seen in flesh. The cost was twice the cost of the paisa (which also the same dealer had) but I had been lucky to pick up mine earlier from a trader who did not know about Lunawada and its coins.
Amit

[Salvete]

Amit,
Sorry it has taken so long to answer your post.  I have been looking at my Rewa Kantha coppers (What does 'Rewa Kantha' mean, please?) and cannot decide if the halves are paisas cut into two after striking, as you suggest, or struck from smaller blanks.  Either way, the weight accuracy seems not to have been high!  The motif on halves looks quite centrally placed, which they would not be if the coins had been cut after striking, I think.  But the jury's out, so far as I am concerned. Sunth halves are almost certainly cut before striking, I think.
  Of all those Rewa Kantha coins I have bought, about a third are KM.9.1.  Most of the rest are pretty scarce, at least I have not seen many.  Some I have never seen at all.  Again, I think overstrikes will assist with placing the designs into order, and there are quite a few of those available.  I think there may be more varieties of 'open hand' coins than are shown in Krause, but haven't had time to check mine carefully enough, so if there is more than one hand on each die, I am probably wrong.  If you have any ideas or evidence about that, I would be interested to hear from you, Amit.  What was the meaning of the open hand?  It looks very like the 'Sutti' marks I saw at Jaisalmer, but why would anybody put such an emblem on a coin?
  The corners are cut off some coins, suggesting that some care was taken over weights, but there is still a deal of variation in the weights of finished coins, so, again, I am a little confused.  The copper plates from which the blanks were cut looks to be even thickness for the most part, and well flattened.  Do we know what was the source of the metal?  And why were a few coins made round (-ish)  if it was cut from plates?
  Do you have readings for the legends (if any) on the Sunth coins?  It seems to consist of 'Rampur' repeated, but maybe some were also dated?  How do we know for sure which state struck which coins?
  An interesting series, but hard to study because they are a bit scarce, and some seem to be rare.
  Best wishes.
Barry
 

[asm]

The expert strikes again: the copper coin is a paisa of the small Indian state of Lunavada, struck in the name of  Wakhat Singhji 1867-1929. On the obv. a lion going right, underneath a sword and the date in Vikrama Samvat 1949 (1892). Above the lion "Lunavada" in Gujerati. This is KM#10.

The rev, says in Gujarati "Ma Ra Sri"
                                    "Vaghat"
                                    "Singhji"

Peter

Peter the Gujarati Legend reads:

                                    "Ma Ra Sri"
                                    "Wakhat"
                                    "Singhji"


Another thing that I notice from the picture of the KM catalogue is that the die seems to be for striking multiple coins at one time. If you see closely the first letter of each line (whether present on the coin or not) is repeated at the end. This leads me to believe that the die may have been for multiple coins which were cut later and hence you had a small mismatch of weight of coins.

Amit

[Salvete]

"This leads me to believe that the die may have been for multiple coins which were cut later and hence you had a small mismatch of weight of coins."

Amit, that is a fascinating conjecture, and the design of the 'open hand' coins does suggest it as a possibilty.  Does anybody know if that actually happenned anywhere?  Has anyone seen multiple coin dies?  Could anything that big be struck hard enough to make the bold impressions typical of these coins on a group of 4 or 9 coins all at once?
Barry

[Figleaf]

The variables to consider are:

• the weight of the hammer, the heavier the hammer, the harder the blow
• the speed of te hammer (the strength of the minter)
• the shape of the upper die
• the size of the die
• the temperature of the flan

I am assuming that the lower die is mounted on a stable underground. The impact of the blow is determined by weight and speed, taking into account that minters need to be able to work all day. Striking a big coin requires virtually the same strength as striking multiple small coins with the same diameter.

The force of the blow is transferred from the handle of the die to the die itself. If the handle is stick-like, most of the force will be exerted in the centre of the die. This is perfect for single coin strikes. An equal distribution across the die can be obtained by a cone shaped mount/handle, just covering the die. Such an upper die would be able to strike multiple coins. There is still the issue of stability. The blow should not destabilize the upper die, so striking two coins at a time is likely to give bad results. From three coins on, everything should be fine, as long as the flans are of equal thickness.

Results could be improved by heating the flans. It is my impression that this was a known technique in India, as I see so many coins that have a clear, deep impression and few "echo" strikes, that are so common on older European coins: the hammer would be thrown up by the resistance of the underground and make a second impression, very close to the first one. I have struck coins myself and found that the hard part was the effect of the blow on your own body.

It will be very hard to prove or disprove multiple striking of coins, unless we find error strikes showing parts of a die that didn't belong on the coin or consistent ex-centrism. I am not aware of either, but there is so much yet to discover.

Peter