World of Coins

Modern European coins except the euro => UK and Ireland => Regular circulating decimal coins => Topic started by: <k> on November 06, 2014, 03:51:13 AM

Title: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: <k> on November 06, 2014, 03:51:13 AM
The biggest reveal in today’s announcement is that these 2015 UK coins will be the last coins to feature the fourth portrait of Her Majesty The Queen, with the effigy expected to be replaced in 2015. - See more at: http://blog.royalmint.com/2015-uk-coins-announced/

I think the Queen should have said that enough is enough. Who wants to be portrayed aged nearly 90? (Not me - I'll just be a skeleton). I notice that she won't allow the definitive stamps to be updated, which show her in her thirties.
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: Abhay on November 06, 2014, 04:22:54 AM
The Royal Mint have announced today that the current portrait used on both circulation and many commemorative coins will be replaced with a new effigy from 2015.

HM Queen Elizabeth II, who will mark her 63rd year of reign on the 6th February 2015, has been portrayed on British, commonwealth and colonial coinage since 1953. The first definitive portrait of Her Majesty was created by sculptress Mary Gillick which saw the young Queen, just 26 years old, wearing a garland of olive leaves – shoulders also shown. This portrait remained in use until 1970 when the last of the shilling coinage was produced. A new second portrait, created by the talented artist Arnold Machin would without doubt, become for most well-known portrait of the Queen, synonymous with the new Elizabethan age. Her Majesty is seen wearing Queen Mary’s tiara – given to her by her Grandmother – also depicted with a flowing drape around her shoulders. This iconic portrait would remain in use from 1968 with the production of the new 5 and 10 new Pence coins (in preparation for Decimal Day in February 1971) until its retirement in 1985. A new “diadem” portrait was introduced as the Queen’s third depiction which was the work of Raphael Maklouf. This more mature depiction of the Queen was very well received, she is wearing a diadem and was designed without shoulders shown. In 1998, the now instantly recognizable image of the Queen, the fourth portrait by Artist Ian Rank-Broadley was introduced to critical acclaim. Showing a more mature face, the portrait was described as having stronger features and quite detailed. The Queen is once more depicted wearing Queen Mary’s tiara.

With the retirement of this fourth portrait next year, this portrait would have been in use for 16 years, the longest time any numismatic image has been utilized. The Royal Mint announced that the new portrait, which will be the Queen’s fifth – and not yet decided on, will be chosen by a closed competition commissioned by the Royal Mint Advisory Committee (RMAC) where a number of specialist designers are invited to submit designs under anonymous cover, before a winner is selected by the RMAC.

The Royal Mint have also announced that 2015 will be something of a vintage year for UK coins, and that the first 2015 dated coins to be released, such as the new 2015 Sovereign, will be the last ever coins to feature the current effigy that has become so familiar to us all. This 2015 Sovereign will be a particularly special issue, as the early editions will feature the current portrait by Ian Rank-Broadley, while those struck in 2015 will be amongst the very first to feature the new effigy.

As the Queen will also be celebrating another milestone anniversary later on in 2015, that of the longest reign in British history, this portrait, will most likely be included in commemorative coinage celebrating this extraordinary once-in-a-lifetime event.

Source:  Coin Update (http://news.coinupdate.com/royal-mint-announces-plans-for-new-queen-elizabeth-ii-effigy-4555/)

Abhay
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: augsburger on November 06, 2014, 02:11:22 PM
Chances she'll die next year seem to have increased........

Will they make her older? Will they make it groovy? Or will it just be something similar to what we have now. At least that gives me 12 months of something to wonder...
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: Arminius on November 06, 2014, 03:56:49 PM
Whatever it will look like, it certainly will look better than a lifelike Charles effigy.

 ;)
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: chrisild on November 06, 2014, 07:09:12 PM
How many portraits of Queen Victoria have been used on (UK) coins? I know of five, so of course QE wants to have five as well. ;)  And Charles, come on. His portrait on the 2008 £5 coin is not bad ...

Christian
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: FosseWay on November 06, 2014, 08:55:36 PM
Victoria:

Young head
Bun head (bronze only)
Jubilee head (silver only)
Veiled head
Gothic, as used on the florin and crown, somewhat reminiscent of the effigy used on Indian coins.

Think that's the lot for the mainland UK, though there were numerous die varieties of the first two.
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: Bimat on November 07, 2014, 03:37:28 PM
Chances she'll die next year seem to have increased........

Ohh please, I don't want to see another bunch of coins commemorating her death then...

Aditya
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: augsburger on November 07, 2014, 03:53:23 PM
Well she needs to make it past the date she becomes the longest serving monarch, then have coins for that, then die, and have coins for that, plus new portrait for her, then charles, then he'll abdicate and new coins for william too, plus abdication coins and throning ceremonies and stuff. We could go for YEARS if they'd follow the script.  >:D
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: Bimat on November 07, 2014, 03:58:43 PM
Well she needs to make it past the date she becomes the longest serving monarch, then have coins for that, then die, and have coins for that, plus new portrait for her, then charles, then he'll abdicate and new coins for william too, plus abdication coins and throning ceremonies and stuff. We could go for YEARS if they'd follow the script.  >:D

Don't forget the second Royal Baby expected in 2015... >:D

Aditya
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: chrisild on November 07, 2014, 06:14:39 PM
Victoria:

Young head
Bun head (bronze only)
Jubilee head (silver only)
Veiled head
Gothic, as used on the florin and crown, somewhat reminiscent of the effigy used on Indian coins.

Think that's the lot for the mainland UK, though there were numerous die varieties of the first two.

Ah, thanks! And no, you cannot be queen for more years than Victoria and have fewer portraits on coins. ;)  Well, I wish Elizabeth a long life but still think she should step back in late 2015. Some time after mid-September or so maybe? So this could become a one-year or two-year portrait ...

Christian
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: augsburger on November 07, 2014, 10:05:04 PM
The queen won't step back. It's all to do with Edward VIII. They blame his abdication on the death of her father, George VI. She would never contemplate stepping down. She will die queen.
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: chrisild on November 07, 2014, 11:25:42 PM
Others do it, even a Pope did it. Well, maybe she won't - up to her. Hope she has some more years in relatively good shape. And as for the effigy on coins, fortunately such portraits are not photographic. Think of Margrethe in Denmark; her portrait now looks better in my opinion that what they used before. :)

Christian
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: Pabitra on November 08, 2014, 07:43:45 AM
Well, I wish Elizabeth a long life but still think she should step back in late 2015. Some time after mid-September or so maybe?

NO, God forbid no.
How many countries would have their sets revised?
By my count, around 25.
Getting sets of UK, Canada, Australia and Newzealand is easy.
Bahamas, Falklands, Isle of Man etc. is really tough.
I am still stuck on incomplete set of Gibraltar.
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: Bimat on November 08, 2014, 08:05:39 AM
NO, God forbid no.
How many countries would have their sets revised?
By my count, around 25.
Getting sets of UK, Canada, Australia and Newzealand is easy.
Bahamas, Falklands, Isle of Man etc. is really tough.
I am still stuck on incomplete set of Gibraltar.

Agree! Also don't forget pseudo stuff (for those who collect it) from Niue, Palau, Nauru etc etc... :D

Aditya
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: Pabitra on November 08, 2014, 10:14:18 AM
The biggest reveal in today’s announcement is that these 2015 UK coins will be the last coins to feature the fourth portrait of Her Majesty The Queen, with the effigy expected to be replaced in 2015.

Will they be issued on first Monday of June, when the Queen's birthday is celebrated.
Cook Islands plan to issue a new series of circulation coins on the eve of Golden Jubilee of its Self Governance, on August 4, 2015.
Hopefully, new coins of Cook Islands will carry new effigy.
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: augsburger on November 08, 2014, 03:12:03 PM
I doubt they'll be released in June. I'd suggest that 2016 will have a different portrait. This is in keeping with most RM policy to date.
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: <k> on November 09, 2014, 10:23:49 PM
In these times of austerity, we should just reuse the old portraits by conjoining them into a new one.
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: augsburger on November 09, 2014, 10:51:58 PM
Or we could just the global market take hold, reduce regulation to zero

(https://sp.yimg.com/ib/th?id=HN.608047707381039403&pid=15.1&P=0)

We allow people to make their OWN portrait.
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: chrisild on November 10, 2014, 12:16:56 PM
QE ages gracefully but may still not want to see various portraits, at various ages, on British circulation coins. The Make-Your-Own-Portrait could work though. 8)

Christian
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: UK Decimal + on December 01, 2014, 11:12:16 AM

One important point to remember is that British Tradition decrees that successive portraits of the Monarch should become LARGER.   This proves to me yet another failing with our current (2008+) coinage.

Bill.
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: <k> on January 30, 2015, 12:29:03 PM
http://www.royalmint.com/aboutus/news/the-royal-mint-commemorates-artist-of-first-queens-portrait

The Royal Mint has revealed when the eagerly awaited fifth coinage portrait of Her Majesty The Queen will be unveiled to the world.

The news was announced to mark the fiftieth anniversary of the death of Mary Gillick - the first artist to capture The Queen’s portrait for her nation’s coins.

The new fifth definitive portrait of The Queen and its designer will be officially announced at a special ceremony on Monday 2 March 2015 and will begin to appear on UK coins from that date onwards.

Today (27 January) marks 50 years since the death of the sculptor Mary Gillick, whose first coinage portrait of The Queen appeared on the coins of the UK and some commonwealth countries from 1953 until decimalisation took place in 1971.

Gillick’s portrait, which is still struck on Maundy Money, portrays The Queen wearing a wreath on her head and was considered to be fresh, evocative and reflective of the nation’s optimism as it greeted a new monarch in the post-war years.

There have been just four official UK definitive coin portraits created during The Queen’s 62 year reign, with the most recent portrait by Ian Rank-Broadley FRBS acting as a familiar presence on our coins since 1998.

The fifth definitive portrait has been chosen by a closed competition commissioned by the Royal Mint Advisory Committee (RMAC) where a number of specialist designers were invited to submit designs under anonymous cover, before a winner was selected by the RMAC.

Adam Lawrence, Chief Executive of The Royal Mint, said, “This change of Royal portrait will make 2015 a vintage year for UK coins, and it will be hugely exciting for us all to see the new design appear on the coins we use every day. All newly issued 2015 year dated coins will continue to be struck with the current portrait of The Queen until the new portrait and its designer are announced on 2 March, when the new design will be struck on coins made after that date. It seemed fitting to confirm when the new design will be revealed at a time when many are paying tribute to the first artist to produce a coinage portrait of The Queen, and we wanted to mark the occasion by reminding people of one of Gillick’s great accomplishments as a sculptor.”
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: Bimat on March 02, 2015, 09:48:49 AM
The new portrait was unveiled just few seconds ago (3 seconds to be precise :o). Image source: Royal Mint on twitter.

Aditya
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: Bimat on March 02, 2015, 09:56:37 AM
Better pic...(Same image source!)

Aditya
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: <k> on March 02, 2015, 10:18:06 AM
Here is the topic I prepared for Jody Clark two days ago:

Jody Clark, coin designer (http://www.worldofcoins.eu/forum/index.php/topic,31109.0.html).

Does anybody know of any other of his designs?
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: <k> on March 02, 2015, 10:22:26 AM
(http://www.worldofcoins.eu/forum/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=40504.0;attach=76764;image)

Compare the new portrait to the current one, which is used worldwide. The difference is not huge. I prefer the current one.

 
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: <k> on March 02, 2015, 10:35:34 AM
And here it is on a 2 pound coin.
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: Bimat on March 02, 2015, 10:35:47 AM
Does anybody know of any other of his designs?

I dropped a question to Royal Mint asking the same on twitter. Let's see if I get a reply... :)

Aditya
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: <k> on March 02, 2015, 10:42:41 AM
On the old Maklouf portrait, she's wearing the same crown.
 
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: Bimat on March 02, 2015, 11:01:14 AM
Got a reply from Royal Mint. They told me what we already knew. ;)

"Jody's most recent work is this 2014 Britannia design: http://www.royalmint.com/shop/The_Britannia_2014_Six_Coin_Silver_Proof_Set"

Aditya
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: chrisild on March 02, 2015, 11:04:21 AM
Compare the new portrait to the current one, which is used worldwide. The difference is not huge. I prefer the current one.

Right, no enormous difference. But with the new portrait QE seems to smile - at least she looks friendlier than on the current one. :)

Christian
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: Bimat on March 02, 2015, 11:07:46 AM
Royal Mint unveils fifth Queen coin portrait - and she's all smiles

A new portrait of the Queen that will appear on coins has been unveiled - but it may be some time before the updated money starts showing up in people's wallets.

The effigy is only the fifth definitive coin portrait to have been created during the Queen's reign and it has been designed by Jody Clark.

Chief engraver at the Royal Mint Gordon Summers described the task as "probably one of the most difficult things for any artist or sculptor to do".

Mr Clark is the first Royal Mint engraver to be chosen to create a definitive royal coinage portrait in more than 100 years.

Aged 33 when his design was selected from a number of anonymous submissions to a design competition, he is the youngest of the five designers to have created the portraits of the Queen that have appeared on UK circulating coins during her 63-year reign.

He said: "I really liked the four previous coin portraits - each one is strong in its own way.

"I hope that I've done Her Majesty justice and captured her as I intended, in a fitting representation. The news that my design had been chosen was quite overwhelming, and I still can't quite believe that my royal portrait will be featured on millions of coins, playing a small part in the Royal Mint's 1,000-year history."

The portrait shows a side profile of the Queen wearing a crown and drop earrings.

Mr Clark, who is originally from the Lake District and who celebrated his 34th birthday yesterday, said his family are "really proud", adding: "They've had to keep quiet about this.

"It's going to be hard to top this. It's going to take a while to sink in."

He said his top priority was to create an "accurate" representation of the Queen.

He added: "I'm really happy with how it's turned out. I can only hope everyone appreciates it."

Kevin Clancy, director of the Royal Mint Museum, said the judging panel's decision was "pretty unanimous" and added that this latest portrait is "astonishingly significant". He said it had "a good likeness and a dignified likeness".

Mr Clancy said there was not a "strict brief" sent to potential designers.

Mr Clark's portrayal of the Queen, wearing the Royal Diamond Diadem crown worn for her Coronation, was selected in a closed competition organised by the Royal Mint Advisory Committee (RMAC), a consultative panel to HM Treasury comprising experts from such fields as history, sculpture, architecture, art and design.

A number of specialist designers from across Britain were invited to submit their own interpretations of the Queen's portrait under anonymous cover, and each one was judged on its merits and suitability before the winning artwork was recommended to the Chancellor and, ultimately, the Queen for approval.

Adam Lawrence, chief executive of the Royal Mint, said: "This change of royal portrait will make 2015 a vintage year for UK coins, and it will be hugely exciting for us all to see the new design appear on the coins we use every day.

"Jody's achievement is something that we can celebrate as a proud moment for the Royal Mint.

"Capturing a portrait on the surface of a coin demands the utmost skill, and is one of the most challenging disciplines of the coin designer's art.

"The last Royal Mint engraver to be commissioned to undertake a royal portrait was George William de Saulles, who engraved the portrait of Edward VII which first appeared on the coinage in 1902."

Coins featuring the new effigy go into production today and the public are being urged to keep an eye on their coins later this year when it will start to appear.

New coins tend to be delivered to cash centres and banks in the first instance.

The unveiling took place at the National Portrait Gallery in central London.

The Royal Mint announced the date of the unveiling of the new portrait in January, to mark the 50th anniversary of the death of Nottingham-born sculptor Mary Gillick, who was the first artist to capture the Queen's portrait for the nation's coins.

Issued in 1953, the Gillick portrait depicted the Queen wearing a wreath of laurel, rather than the crown that we are used to seeing today. The portrait, which is still struck on Maundy Money, was considered to reflect the country's optimism as it greeted a new monarch in the post-Second World War era.

The most recent portrait of the Queen on coins has been appearing since 1998. It was created by Surrey-born artist Ian Rank-Broadley, whose aim was that the portrait should be recognisable and not "over-idealised''.

While artists' interpretations of the Queen's image have changed over time, one tradition which has remained constant is that the Queen has continued to be depicted facing right. This is in accordance with a tradition that can be traced back to the 17th century, whereby successive monarchs face in alternate directions on coins.

According to the Royal Mint Museum, some people believe that this tradition could originate from the desire of Charles II to turn his back on Oliver Cromwell, although the museum suggests that this may be too convenient an explanation and it might be better to concede that if any reason has existed for this, it has long since been forgotten.

The museum said that even during the long reign of Queen Victoria there were no more than five portraits of her on coins, one of which enjoyed such royal favour that it was used for some 50 years.

There were estimated to be around 28.9 billion UK coins in circulation at March 31 last year, with a total face value of more than £4 billion. They were all manufactured by the Royal Mint, which has a history of more than 1,000 years of producing British coinage.

The Royal Mint said that existing coins which are in current use will remain in general circulation until they are naturally recycled due to wear and tear, usually when they are around 20 to 25 years old, and their use will not be affected by the new portrait.

Mr Clark, originally from Bowness-on-Windermere, studied illustration at the University of Central Lancashire before gaining experience in computer-aided design in the packaging industry, among other freelance illustration and design projects.

Since embarking on his career at the Royal Mint, he has worked on projects such as the medals struck to celebrate the 2014 Ryder Cup and a Nato summit.

Source: BT.com (http://home.bt.com/news/uk-news/royal-mint-unveils-fifth-queen-coin-portrait-and-shes-all-smiles-11363965545292)
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: <k> on March 02, 2015, 11:07:56 AM
Got a reply from Royal Mint. They told me what we already knew. ;)

"Jody's most recent work is this 2014 Britannia design: http://www.royalmint.com/shop/The_Britannia_2014_Six_Coin_Silver_Proof_Set"

Aditya

So they don't want to give me anything else for my topic.  :(  They're just jealous that I did one first.  ;)
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: Bimat on March 02, 2015, 11:09:49 AM
And pre-orders of new coins have already started. Look at the price tag! absolute rip-off! >:(

http://www.royalmint.com/our-coins/ranges/the-fifth-definitive-coinage-portrait-final-edition

Aditya
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: augsburger on March 02, 2015, 12:25:20 PM
Well it was always likely to be traditional, difficult to make her look older etc, but she seems to have more of a smile on the new one, the obvious difference is the crown and the hair.
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: Bimat on March 02, 2015, 03:01:05 PM
The new coins have already been struck! :)

The portrait doesn't look as good on the real coin as in digital image IMO.

Aditya
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: augsburger on March 02, 2015, 03:16:33 PM
I can see it growing on people, as you get used to it. It's not bad, it's not shocking, it does what it says on the tin (if there were a tin of course)
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: <k> on March 03, 2015, 12:36:31 AM
Let me review my thoughts now. Of the portraits still in circulation, the Machin effigy is the earliest. It is a superb if romantic portrait, and a classic. Then came the Maklouf portrait in 1985. To my eyes, this was very competent but lacking in character. It gave a suggestion of the Queen, but if looked at closely, it doesn't really look like her. The impression is carried mainly by the hair and the crown.

Next came the effigy by Ian Rank-Broadley, in 1998. As soon as I saw that portrait, I thought it was superb. It was regal, imposing, and yet highly realistic. I regard it as a classic. So Jody Clark has a tough task in competing with such a formidable predecessor. It will take time until the public becomes used to the new portrait. My initial impression is that, yes, it is most definitely the Queen, though not as realistic or accomplished as IRB's portrait. I do not like the smile. Her Majesty is the Queen, not a smiley face. That requires a stateliness, not a smiley face. However, the Queen has seen it and signed it off, so obviously she is happy enough with it. The steep angle of the back of the neck looks unnatural to me. Is that an effect of age? Furthermore, this portrait appears to me to have been somewhat influenced by aspects of IRB's portrait. The crown is different, but all in all the portrait does not look sufficiently different from the current one. Partly that is the Queen's fault. IRB's portrait was issued in 1998. From 1998 to 2015 is a long time, yet on the new portrait she has scarcely aged. And indeed in reality she truly does not look her chronological age. Possibly she has deliberately refused to age, all the better to make all the rest of us feel all the more self-conscious. After all, she is Queen by the grace of God (apparently). If she wants to put a call in to Him up there, to let it be known that she doesn't want to age, probably He just sends down some rejuvenating Royal Jelly for her to scoff, so He can have a bit of peace while she's about it. After all, He wouldn't want to suffer the sharp side of Prince Philip's tongue.

So, all in all, the new portrait is significantly better than Maklouf's, IMO, but it is certainly not up there with the IRB and Machin classics.
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: davidrj on March 03, 2015, 03:32:59 AM
I like the Gillick portrait, still in use on the Maundy coins

(http://i593.photobucket.com/albums/tt14/microtome/maundyset22004.jpg) (http://s593.photobucket.com/user/microtome/media/maundyset22004.jpg.html)

I assume that it is not worth the expense of reworking obverse dies (unchanged since 1954) for such small mintages

David
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: <k> on March 03, 2015, 01:35:42 PM
Since Maundy is a royal ceremony, the Royal Mint/Treasury/Government would probably spend the money if asked. I suspect that the old portrait is part of the tradition, and that people wish to retain it.
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: <k> on March 03, 2015, 06:10:34 PM
It will be interesting to see which countries and territories adopt this portrait, and how quickly. Currently, St Helena and Ascension still uses the Maklouf portrait, and Gibraltar uses an amended version of the Maklouf portrait. Belize still uses the crowned effigy by Cecil Thomas, which was introduced in 1953 for use in the "colonies", as they were known back then. At the time, the colonies, or British overseas territories, were not allowed to use the uncrowned portrait: only sovereign countries, such as the UK, Australia, Ceylon (now Sri Lanka) etc., were allowed to use it.

Two interesting topics for those who wish to see the Queen's various effigies:

1] Portraits used on UK and Commonwealth decimal coins (http://www.worldofcoins.eu/forum/index.php/topic,10641.msg71382.html#msg71382).

2] Portraits of QEII used on world coins (http://www.worldofcoins.eu/forum/index.php/topic,5036.0.html).

 
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: FosseWay on March 03, 2015, 06:20:23 PM
Let me review my thoughts now. Of the portraits still in circulation, the Machin effigy is the earliest. It is a superb if romantic portrait, and a classic. Then came the Maklouf portrait in 1985. To my eyes, this was very competent but lacking in character. It gave a suggestion of the Queen, but if looked at closely, it doesn't really look like her. The impression is carried mainly by the hair and the crown.

Next came the effigy by Ian Rank-Broadley, in 1998. As soon as I saw that portrait, I thought it was superb. It was regal, imposing, and yet highly realistic. I regard it as a classic. So Jody Clark has a tough task in competing with such a formidable predecessor. It will take time until the public becomes used to the new portrait. My initial impression is that, yes, it is most definitely the Queen, though not as realistic or accomplished as IRB's portrait. I do not like the smile. Her Majesty is the Queen, not a smiley face. That requires a stateliness, not a smiley face. However, the Queen has seen it and signed it off, so obviously she is happy enough with it. The steep angle of the back of the neck looks unnatural to me. Is that an effect of age? Furthermore, this portrait appears to me to have been somewhat influenced by aspects of IRB's portrait. The crown is different, but all in all the portrait does not look sufficiently different from the current one. Partly that is the Queen's fault. IRB's portrait was issued in 1998. From 1998 to 2015 is a long time, yet on the new portrait she has scarcely aged. And indeed in reality she truly does not look her chronological age. Possibly she has deliberately refused to age, all the better to make all the rest of us feel all the more self-conscious. After all, she is Queen by the grace of God (apparently). If she wants to put a call in to Him up there, to let it be known that she doesn't want to age, probably He just sends down some rejuvenating Royal Jelly for her to scoff, so He can have a bit of peace while she's about it. After all, He wouldn't want to suffer the sharp side of Prince Philip's tongue.

So, all in all, the new portrait is significantly better than Maklouf's, IMO, but it is certainly not up there with the IRB and Machin classics.

I agree with this assessment, especially the comment that it seems very similar to the IRB portrait. And then the crown is the same as on Maklouf's, if I'm not mistaken. However, the degree to which the Queen has visibly aged is probably less between 1998 and 2015 than between either 1971 and 1985 or 1985 and 1998; you're also right that she doesn't look her age.
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: <k> on March 03, 2015, 06:25:19 PM
I agree with this assessment

FosseWay agrees with me?  :o  By gad, it must be an impostor.  :-X
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: natko on March 03, 2015, 10:18:00 PM
 ::) Just a few weeks ago I said in a talk how I hope the queen will live long, so we don't have to buy numerous new sets from tiny countries around the world. And now this...it's really too much! Especially since it's not a big difference it makes it less interesting I would add, but the new old crown saves the thing.

BTW, contrary to <k>, I really liked Maklouf portrait. By far. It was simply elegant, unlike Rank-Broadley version which is simply too big, especially for a queen this kind of almost neckless effigy is not the most aesthetically pleasant. OK, the years came, of course, but still I remember my disappointment when they came out... Yet, compared to younger Elisabeth, despite I agree on the classic status, Maklouf seems to be...dainty... truly royal and more serious. Or maybe because of the crown, which is really nice.
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: Bimat on March 07, 2015, 02:26:36 PM
By the way, the British Isles and crown dependencies will also change the portrait of the Queen this year itself if I'm not wrong?

Aditya
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: FosseWay on March 07, 2015, 02:34:30 PM
It's not a given that they will do so at all, or if they do, when. Australia changed to the IRB portrait a year later than the UK last time. Jersey never used the Maklouf portrait at all, continuing with Machin until 1997. There are numerous other examples of departures from the norm set in the UK.
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: Pabitra on March 07, 2015, 02:52:10 PM
Some of them will change at earliest and some of them will take their own sweet time.
In 2015, I expect only Gibraltar, Canada and Newzealand to change.
2016 should see Australia, Isle of Man, Jersey and Guernsey to change.
Last would be perhaps Falkland Islands.

You could hold a "guessing" competition on this forum.
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: <k> on March 07, 2015, 03:00:18 PM
By the way, the British Isles and crown dependencies will also change the portrait of the Queen this year itself if I'm not wrong?

Aditya

Usually the Crown dependencies keep in step with Britain. Who do you mean by the British Isles? St Helena and Ascension still use the Maklouf portrait. Gibraltar uses its own version of the Maklouf portrait.
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: andyg on March 07, 2015, 05:02:38 PM
In 2015, I expect only Gibraltar, Canada and Newzealand to change.

Canada has been out of step for some time - are there plans to change their portrait? (It's a little newer than the UK portrait)
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: Pabitra on March 07, 2015, 05:35:49 PM
Royal Canadian Mint is perhaps the most aggressive large mint to come out design variations at every little opportunity they can get.
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: Bimat on March 08, 2015, 07:04:09 AM
Who do you mean by the British Isles?

I realized it late that British Isles and Crown Dependencies actually mean the same ;D but decided to keep my post as it is..

Aditya
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: Pabitra on March 08, 2015, 07:27:54 AM
It's not a given that they will do so at all, or if they do, when. Australia changed to the IRB portrait a year later than the UK last time. Jersey never used the Maklouf portrait at all, continuing with Machin until 1997. There are numerous other examples of departures from the norm set in the UK.


Her Majesty's effigy appears on following 16 circulation coins of various countries.

Perhaps, we can start with the list of effigies for each of the nations

Australia
Belize
Bermuda
Canada
Cayman Islands
Cook Islands
East Caribbean States
Falkland Islands
Gibraltar
Guernsey
Isle of Man
Jersey
New Zealand
Saint Helena & Ascension Islands
Solomon Islands
United Kingdom

We then can monitor which obverse change.
Unlike last time, when UK had old effigy on 1997 coins but only new effigy on 1998 coins, this year the Royal mint has not followed the tradition. Although, this year (2015), no coins with old effigy has so far come into circulation, one can not rule out the possibility since 2015 has two sets with one effigy each.
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: kena on March 08, 2015, 09:55:07 AM
It is not exactly true that no coins with the old portrait have entered into circulation since the Royal Mint did put 100 of the Royal Navy coins into circulation (same one that they are selling for £10).

http://www.royalmint.com/aboutus/news/royal-navy-2-pound-coin

Ken
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: andyg on March 08, 2015, 10:45:21 AM
It is not exactly true that no coins with the old portrait have entered into circulation since the Royal Mint did put 100 of the Royal Navy coins into circulation (same one that they are selling for £10).

http://www.royalmint.com/aboutus/news/royal-navy-2-pound-coin

Ken

In addition some while ago there was a film produced by the mint showing 2015 pound coins being minted with the old portrait.
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: andyg on March 08, 2015, 10:48:04 AM

Her Majesty's effigy appears on following 16 circulation coins of various countries.


Of which the current Rank-broadley portrait appears on 13 -
exceptions being Gibraltar, Canada and Belize.  If I were a betting man I would bet that these countries will not change.
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: kena on March 08, 2015, 02:07:21 PM
Here is what I find interesting:

The 2015 Annual BU Set being sold by the Royal Mint has the old portait with the x2 £5, x3 £2 (Royal Navy, Magna Carta, Technology), Battle of Britian 50 pence plus the Royal Shield £1 to 1 pence coins.

Now they have a BU set on sale with the new portait, which has the Royal Shield £1 to 1 pence and the new £2 with Circulating Coinage as part of the description

So there is no mention of a new Battle of Britian 50 pence, Royal Navy £2, Magna Carta  £2, or Technology £2 with the new portait.

Ken
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: Pabitra on March 08, 2015, 03:07:23 PM
Circulation sets with both effigies are available.
For those who, like me, are only into circulation coins would be interested in this dual set offer.


( photo quality suffered due to shrinking to accommodate limit of 128 Kb. If you want High grade image, kindly PM me or go to Royal Mint site)
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: augsburger on March 08, 2015, 03:09:39 PM
Years back the Mint would have just gone into 2015 with one set. But they can make money, lots more money, from those who need every coin.  ::)
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: onecenter on March 08, 2015, 04:28:30 PM
The last couple of years there were separate commemorative sets of British proof coins.  I do not collect the uncirculated sets, so I cannot say whether commemoratives have or will be issued as part of, or as a separate set.  Possibly, the 2015 commemoratives will not be released with the new effigy.  Given the marketing savvy of the British Royal Mint, do not bet against it.

In addition, the sterling silver coins with the new effigy must also be released as well as the piedforts.  We are way too early in the year to think the British Royal Mint has made all their coin issue decisions for the year.
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: Bimat on March 14, 2015, 07:17:44 AM
A funny take on the new portrait (with alternate designs) :D

Link (http://news.coinupdate.com/the-royal-portraits-that-didnt-quite-make-the-cut-4727/)

I really like the QR code idea! ;D

Aditya
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: malj1 on March 14, 2015, 12:30:36 PM
We are not amused.  >:D
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: malj1 on March 24, 2015, 01:16:49 AM
Here is a better image.

Taken from the April edition of The Australasian Coin & Banknote Magazine.
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: Alan71 on March 27, 2015, 06:58:28 PM
I've got the Royal Mint set of the eight denominations with the new portrait.  As others have said, it isn't all that different to the Rank-Broadley one.  It's the difference in the inscription that is more significant.  For once we have the date the right way up!  To me it's the most important thing on a non-commemorative coin so it's good to see it at the top.

However, I don't really see the point in expanding the abbreviation.  Either in Latin or English, it means fairly little in modern Britain.  It's time it went really.  Other than those with an interest in coins (or Latin), who would know what it means?  By the grace of God, Queen, Defender of the faith. It makes her sound like she stands outside churches all the time, warding off some sort of threat!

A little known fact about the new design is that it means, for the first time since 1981, all circulating denominations have exactly the same inscription (including the date) on the obverse.  Either the 20p or £2 (or both) have scuppered that from 1982 onwards.
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: Figleaf on March 27, 2015, 10:52:26 PM
Defender of the Faith is traditionally and religiously correct, which is not a great argument, but there you are. The Arabic equivalent would be amir al-muminin (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amir_al-Mu'minin), a popular title among dead despots.

It has an important difference in connotation, though. The English variant is conjuring up a picture of a well-fed royal (say Henry VIII) on a somewhat inelegant, but big, strong horse saying: now watch, rabble while I defend the faith. The Arabic version reminds you more of a despot suffering from a severe case of conspicuous consumption on a fiery horse saying: all right, rabble. This is your chance. Go down and defend the faith while I watch. It's just a bit more practical, more realistic and less dangerous to the ruler's health. ;)

Peter
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: Bimat on April 10, 2015, 06:06:12 PM
Coins with new portrait of Queen have been struck. Watch your change! 8)

Aditya
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: Alan71 on April 11, 2015, 10:22:09 PM
They were struck before the unveiling of the new portrait, in order for sets to be produced!

It will be interesting what we will get this year.  The 1p with the old portrait dated 2015 has been issued, but I hope not all the denominations are.  There are three potential £1 coin types and three £2 coins with either old or new standard designs.  And will the commemoratives be issued with the new portrait?

I do hope the Royal Mint's monopoly on collector coins is broken at some point.  It's long overdue.
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: Figleaf on April 16, 2015, 05:17:10 PM
I do hope the Royal Mint's monopoly on collector coins is broken at some point.  It's long overdue.

You would be disappointed if it was. As the Greeks put it, the gods fulfil the wishes of those they want to condemn. In economic-technical terms, this is a monopolistic market: one seller, many buyers*. Putting dealers in the distribution chain would make it a oligopoly. The remedy for a monopoly is government oversight. That is in place. Therefore, to change the pricing behaviour, you should start a political lobby. I predict failure. To short-term oriented politicians, price gouging of government institutions is an opportunity for non-tax income that must not be missed (compare passport pricing, which is tempered only by potential charges of hindering international mobility, not by actual cost.)

There is no remedy for an oligopoly where demand is so small that you cannot get to the point where sellers do not dominate buyers. The result is a kinked demand curve (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kinked_demand), which is a recipe for overpricing and anti-competitive behaviour. In other words, dealers would all charge the same price. If any dealer would charge a higher price, he would sell nothing. If any dealer would sell at a lower price, he could sell more than his stock. There is therefore a very large incentive to stick to the price all other dealers charge.

People often think supply and demand curves will solve all problems. It's almost the contrary.

Peter

* It's not a pure monopoly, as there is (weak) competition from coins not in sets, sets of other countries, stamps, electronic games etc.
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: Alan71 on April 18, 2015, 12:31:57 PM
Do you work for the Royal Mint by any chance?  :)

Well, anyway, I managed to get the Royal Arms £1 for £11 off eBay (postage included in that) so that's £2 less than the Mint.  Still extortionate though.  There's no way of buying this coin otherwise as it isn't included in any set, this is the first £1 coin to only be available separately.

I would like to see circulation-quality coins made available at the start of the year.  For instance, each coin in the year set available to buy at a fraction above face value.  They could just put them in a plastic pocket sheet and let the buyer (or dealer/seller) assemble a set.  The reason for my buying the year sets is to get all the coins at the start of the year.  Apart from the £5 coins, all of them tend to end up in circulation by the end of the year anyway.  In the 1980s and 1990s, you'd get the year set knowing that at least one of the coins (but often two or more) would never enter circulation.  Since 2000, this hasn't been the case and (apart from a few shield design 50p coins and rarities such as Kew Gardens) they're fairly easy to get from circulation.

Guessing the reason they won't do this is because it would mean even fewer people would bother with the expensive year sets.  BU or uncirculated, there isn't that much difference, and certainly not worth what they charge for them. 
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: tonyclayton on April 26, 2015, 12:19:14 AM
One important point to remember is that British Tradition decrees that successive portraits of the Monarch should become LARGER.   This proves to me yet another failing with our current (2008+) coinage.

Bill.

What tradition is this?  Never heard of it. George IV went smaller. William IV did not change
Victoria went smaller then larger
E VII, GV, EVIII and GVI did not change
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: Alan71 on April 26, 2015, 02:35:36 AM
^^ Guessing Bill was just referring to the portraits of the current Queen, but if it is a tradition, it's only a recent one.

Not sure what Bill means about the 2008+ coinage being a failure in that respect though.  The portrait didn't change in 2008, it continued to use the Rank-Broadley one introduced in 1998.  It did, however, become very slightly larger on circular coins issued from 2008 due to the beading on those coins being removed.

It would have been difficult to make the portrait larger than the Rank-Broadley one without shrinking the lettering!  This has been done anyway due to longer abbreviations being used.
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: Pabitra on April 26, 2015, 03:48:50 AM
What tradition is this?  Never heard of it. George IV went smaller. William IV did not change
Victoria went smaller then larger
E VII, GV, EVIII and GVI did not change
I think that it was referring to some tradition about successive portraits of the same monarch. Which monarchs other than the queens have had more than one portrait?
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: FosseWay on April 26, 2015, 10:57:58 AM
I think that it was referring to some tradition about successive portraits of the same monarch. Which monarchs other than the queens have had more than one portrait?

Starting from 1816 when the coinage was reformed:

George III (1816-20) - at least 3 portraits ("bull" head, the less unflattering one it was replaced with, and the one used on the crown)
George IV (1820-30) - as mentioned by someone above, the first head was a rather portly-looking laureate effigy, while the second was a slimmer, smaller, bare head
William IV (1830-7) - only one head AFAIK
Edward VII (1901-10) - ditto
George V (1910-36) - 3 portraits, but the differences are for technical reasons rather than a desire to portray the passage of time in the monarch's features.
Edward VIII (1936) - one
George VI (1936-52) - one
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: Alan71 on June 25, 2015, 08:29:05 AM
New portrait 2015 1p coins are now being issued... Got my first one on change yesterday.
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: eurocoin on February 11, 2016, 07:16:48 PM
I asked the currency managers of the treasuries of all countries that currently use a portrait of Queen Elizabeth II on their circulating coins* whether they are planning to introduce the new effigy by Jody Clark in the near future:

Australia: No
Belize: No
Bermuda:
Cayman Islands:
Cook Islands:
Eastern Caribbean States: No
Gibraltar: No
Guernsey: No
Falkland Islands: No
Isle of Man: No
Jersey: No
New Zealand: No
Saint Helena & Ascension:
Solomon Islands: Perhaps on circulating commemoratives; no plans to mint new circulating coins in the near future.

*Excluding Canada.
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: Alan71 on February 11, 2016, 10:49:49 PM
I'm wondering what's really going on here.  Is the Royal Mint imposing some charge for using the new portrait, hence no where wanting to use it?  Presumably the Royal Mint as it used to be offered the portrait to any country that showed an interest.  Or is it the fact that it's not that much different to the Rank-Broadley one?  All previous portraits have been significantly different to the one before it, clearly showing an ageing Queen.  This one almost seemed like a change for the sake of it, because the Rank-Broadley one had been in use for longer than any other (narrowly beating the Machin's 17-year UK run by a few months, although Australia had used the Machin for longer).

I don't blame them really.  The Queen still looks like she does in the Rank-Broadley portrait, so no reason for them to change.
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: <k> on February 11, 2016, 11:43:38 PM
Yes, the IRB portrait is far superior to the Clark effigy. No reason to change it.
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: andyg on February 12, 2016, 06:49:38 PM
I actually prefer the new one - always thought the old one looked too cluttered with the dots and large writing. Latterly they removed the dots, but we still had the large writing.
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: FosseWay on February 12, 2016, 09:21:02 PM
I tend to agree with andyg about the text size, but with <k> about the portrait itself. Retaining the IRB portrait but refining the text would have been ideal.
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: Alan71 on February 13, 2016, 03:11:02 AM
Yes, I agree.  The text size is the most noticeable difference about the new portrait.  That and the fact the abbreviations are expanded and it starts top right instead of bottom left.  I do like the fact that the date is the right way up.  I tend to look at the text first on the new portrait coins, as at first glance I often think the portrait itself is the IRB.
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: augsburger on February 17, 2016, 08:33:07 AM
A new portrait was always going to appear, they've appeared at intervals throughout her reign. Having something different is just that, it shows progress through her reign, even if she was old looking in both periods of time. Will she make it to the next portrait? Maybe, maybe they wouldn't bother. If she got to 100 years old I think they'd definitely do something.
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: Bimat on February 17, 2016, 08:45:20 AM
If she got to 100 years old I think they'd definitely do something.

Yes, with a new slogan like 'Enough now, time to retire!' ;D

Aditya
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: augsburger on February 17, 2016, 09:37:26 AM
Nobody wants her to retire, because Charles is next, and the PR he's done in the last 15 years or so still isn't enough to make people want him to be king.
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: Pabitra on February 17, 2016, 12:43:45 PM
I also do not want her to retire.
I wish her a really long life.
Otherwise, I will have to arrange new sets of more than 20 countries.
Will put a big hole in my pocket.
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: Figleaf on February 17, 2016, 04:51:18 PM
Won't make any difference, Pabitra. They'll just come up with a new portrait and you'll still want the "new" types. Only a republic would give numismatic stability. >:D

Peter
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: Alan71 on February 17, 2016, 07:57:53 PM
I'm certainly no royalist, but I do have some respect for the Queen.  I hope she lives for a long time yet.  Charles is 70 in 2018... if the Queen lives as long as her mother then he will be pushing 80 by then.  Hardly worth it.  May as well jump to William.  In fact, as William is already about five years older than the Queen was when she ascended the throne, I'm even starting to think that, if the Queen lasts long enough, it should jump to George.
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: Pabitra on February 18, 2016, 01:09:11 AM
Won't make any difference, Pabitra. They'll just come up with a new portrait and you'll still want the "new" types. Only a republic would give numismatic stability. >:D

Not all territories and dependencies have changed effigies at same rate as UK.
Change of Queen by a King ( Charles or William) would legally require immediate change over.
Just managed change of Aruba and Antilles.
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: eurocoin on January 04, 2017, 11:43:28 AM
2016-dated 2p and 20p coins have been issued.  One of each sold on eBay (to me!) with photos clearly showing the obverses.  I have made enquiries with another contact to find out which others (if any) dated 2016 are out.

I assume they used the Ian Rank-Broadley portrait?
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: Alan71 on January 04, 2017, 01:33:47 PM
Yes, still using the Rank-Broadley portrait.  There are still no takers for the Jody Clark one, are there?  I'm starting to think of it as an unofficial portrait.  Until it's taken up by the likes of Australia and New Zealand (and looks like quite a big "if") I will still think of the Rank-Broadley portrait as being the latest official one and the Jody Clark as a UK variation.
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: eurocoin on January 04, 2017, 01:52:05 PM
Thanks for the information, that is exactly what I thought and what they told me in February of last year.

Quote
There are still no takers for the Jody Clark one, are there?

Not yet, but who knows what the near future holds ;)
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: <k> on January 04, 2017, 01:59:21 PM
Of course the Jody Clark portrait is official. It circulates in the UK, which is a sovereign country. Do we gain our sovereignty only insofar as we are a member of the Commonwealth? No. The fact that Australia and New Zealand are also sovereign countries, and can choose which portraits to use and not to use, introduces more variety into numismatics, which is good for collectors.

Canada has used a different portrait from the UK for decades now. Does this mean that the Canadian portraits of the Queen are unofficial? No, of course not.
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: Alan71 on January 04, 2017, 02:51:41 PM
I was only referring to how I personally think of it.  I wasn't planning on starting a debate about sovereignty!
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: <k> on January 05, 2017, 01:49:07 AM
I was only referring to how I personally think of it.  I wasn't planning on starting a debate about sovereignty!

Legal issues have everything to do with sovereignty, so you are guilty of incorrect thinking. The Jody Clark portrait is official in the UK, whether countries or territories elsewhere use it or not. You could mislead people, who come here looking for accurate and factual information, into thinking it is unofficial.
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: Figleaf on January 05, 2017, 09:50:09 AM
Come on <k>, he was just saying even the crypto-colonies don't use the Clark portrait. Maybe they know your queen is sick and are plotting for independence :) Besides, the UK has too much sovereinty as it is, you don't need you to add to it :) Rather beware of those guys in raincoats with upturned collar and homburg carrying an umbrella when it doesn't rain. ;)

Peter
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: <k> on January 05, 2017, 01:01:42 PM
Come on <k>, he was just saying even the crypto-colonies don't use the Clark portrait. Maybe they know your queen is sick and are plotting for independence :) Besides, the UK has too much sovereinty as it is, you don't need you to add to it :)

Peter

He wasn't just saying that. He was suggesting it was unofficial. That is exactly the wrong word to use, because it will confuse the readers. In the coin world, if something is not official, then it is not legal. If it is not legal, then it is not legal tender. And if it is not legal tender, then it is not a coin: it is a fantasy. Apart from that, if people believe the portrait is "unofficial", it's a short leap from that to suggesting it will become rare and valuable.

So, I am arguing from the point of view of legality, as it affects sovereignty. Once upon a time, of course, Britain dictated what effigy the Dominions (overseas realms) and colonies (overseas territories) should have. I think it is a good thing that they can choose or reject the portrait that the UK uses. I would actually have made the same choice as many of them and continued with the IRB portrait. However, my opinion on all this doesn't matter. What matters is the situation on the ground. The Clark portrait is official in the UK, whatever the Commonwealth realms choose to use. By that logic, you would have to say that the stand-alone Canadian portraits have NEVER been official, and then it just gets silly because that is plain wrong.

If Britain had joined the euro under Blair, then we would have had different rules, and I would have accepted them. There is no chance I would have declared the Queen's euro unofficial and thrown it away in the street. So I think you and Alan71 should both be sent to bed without any supper for arguing such nonsense. Goodness knows where we'd be, if we had people like you as lawmakers.  :-X
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: Alan71 on January 05, 2017, 02:38:37 PM
Thanks Peter for coming to my defence!!

I didn't think it was worth getting into a flap over, let alone creating a separate topic for.

I'm not a fan of the Jody Clark portrait.  It was change for change's sake.  The Rank-Broadley one was the most realistic portrait so far and it was recognisably the Queen.  The new one isn't that different so I'm not surprised no other countries/dependencies/territories have taken it.  And the new, commercially-minded Royal Mint is probably charging too much for its use in comparison to the old portrait (again, that's just my opinion before anyone takes me to task over it!)
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: eurocoin on March 17, 2017, 11:52:18 AM
(https://c2.staticflickr.com/4/3918/33105651960_0cbd980a7a_o.png)

The design competition for the Fifth Effigy of HM Queen Elizabeth II was a standard Royal Mint Advisory Committee Competition which means that also invited designers outside the Royal Mint were allowed to submit designs. Above the 2 portraits that were made by Jody Clark can be seen. The portrait on the left will only be used on coins of the UK. This was done for public recognition and security reasons. The portrait to the right was developed specifically for use on the coins of British Overseas Territories, British Crown Dependencies and the British Commonwealth Countries. There do not exist any further variants nor are any such new variants planned.
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: <k> on March 17, 2017, 12:04:24 PM
The portrait on the left will only be used on coins of the UK. This was done for public recognition and security reasons. The portrait to the right was developed specifically for use on the coins of British Overseas Territories, British Crown Dependencies and the British Commonwealth Countries.

So now we almost have a similar situation to that before 1936, when the Overseas Territories (colonies, in those days), Crown Dependencies and Commonwealth countries (or Dominions) were not allowed to use the British portrait, which was always uncrowned in those days. The Machin portrait was happily used by everybody, but in the 1990s some of the Overseas Territories and Commonwealth Realms took pride in using a different portrait from the UK. It remains to be seen how many of these will use Jody Clark's uncouped portrait.
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: Figleaf on March 17, 2017, 04:35:59 PM
The pharaonic portrait is only one line away from being obscene. If that line becomes indistinct on the real coins, there'll be letters to the editor pointing out that the design looks like Dorian Grey posing for a jewellery ad. Haven't they learned anything since 1953?

Peter
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: eurocoin on October 03, 2018, 05:52:12 PM
UK (2015)
Isle of Man (2017)
Saint Helena and Ascension (2018) (So far only collectors coins)
Australia (2019)

As for the others we know that the East Caribbean States continued to use the Ian Rank-Broadley portrait on recently issued coins of 2017 and that Gibraltar currently uses the Pobjoy Mint portrait.
Title: Re: Royal Mint Announces Plans for New Effigy of Queen Elizabeth II
Post by: eurocoin on December 31, 2019, 07:32:34 PM
I just came across this rip-off of the portrait that Jody Clark made for exclusive use on the coins of the UK, on a collectors coin of Ghana.

(http://www.worldofcoins.eu/forum/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=39617.0;attach=96436;image)