News:

Sign up for the monthly zoom events by sending a PM with your email address to Hitesh

Main Menu

Discussion: New - which became Old in less than two years

Started by Figleaf, September 08, 2007, 02:25:56 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Figleaf

?New? which became ?Old? in less than two years.
by P.K.Saha (our member Pabitra, with permission)

General circulation coins are designed and manufactured for a life, which typically should run in decades. Sovereign governments, normally tend to ensure that design as well as metal content are so selected that they life their useful life. However, things tend to go wrong despite such care.

India, in 2003, decided to redesign its 2 Rupee coin (KM#121), which had been in production since 1992. The reason was simple. The Copper-Nickel coin was expected to cost in metal terms more than its face value in very near future. In such cases, despite stringent laws against melting, the is large scale melting and the vanishing coins place tremendous pressure in smooth day to day commercial activity. Such shortage results in vociferous protests from traders as well as consumers and a democracy is last place, which can stand against such protests. Thus, it was decided to undertake new design and 2003 was the last year the copper-nickel coin was minted.

Since the coin was being redesigned, Government decided to revamp its entire coinage. This was being done for the first time since 1957, when the entire coinage was designed for conversion to decimal currency. Prior to that, the entire coinage was designed in 1950 when the country became independent (in 1947). Issuing of a series is a big work and need less to say that even nations with their own minting history and facilities, may not find it smooth. Thus the minting of 1 rupee was stopped with 2004 being the last year.

- The first series, released in 1950 had 7 coins namely 1 Pice (#1), ? Anna (#2), 1 Anna (#3), 2 Annas (#4), ? Rupee (#5), ? Rupee (#6) and 1 Rupee (#7). The series lasted from 1950 to 1955 and was stopped since the country was to switch over to decimal currency.

- The second series and last one to date was introduced in 1957 and also had 7 coins. They were 1 Paisa (#8), 2 Paise (#11), 5 paise (#16), 10 paise (#24), 25 paise (# 47), 50 paise (# 55) and 1 Rupee (#75). Out of these, first 5 were introduced in 1957 with 6th and 7th coming up only by 1960 and 1962 only.  In 1964, Aluminum was introduced for the first time with 3 paise (#14) and immediately 1paisa and 2 paise were also replaced with Aluminum. 1966 saw change of 5 paise and in 1968, a non standard denomination of 20 paise was introduced with Aluminum Bronze making its first appearance.  By 1977 all coins of this series had been stopped, with 25 paise being stopped the last.

- The Aluminum series, introduced in a staggered manner extended to 20 paise denomination with smaller denominations being stopped altogether. In 1988, stainless steel was introduced in a miniseries with 10 paise, 25 paise and 50 paise. The last of 10 paise was minted in 1998 whereas 25 and 50 paise were minted up to 2002 and 2003 respectively.

Thus, the stage was all set for a new series. The work of design was awarded to the premier design institute of India namely the National Institute of Design (NID) Ahmedabad. Professor Sinha went ahead and submitted his design in 2005, which were accepted. The set contained five coins namely 50 paise, 1 rupee, 2 rupees, 5 rupees and 10 rupees. The nation started looking forward to new designs, which would usher a 21st century design philosophy.

The new 1 Rupee made its appearance in early 2006, with mint date as 2005.  Immediately the 2 rupee appeared in the market with 2005 as the mint date too. Around this time, melting of Cupronickel coins became noticeable with shortage of 2-rupee coin being reported from all corners of the country. The 1 rupee was not affected and govt. stopped minting 1 rupee coins and concentrated only on 2 rupee coins. However, the design of 2-rupee coin attracted criticism from politically strong quarters on religious grounds and government decided to redesign the coin. By this time it was 207 and 2007 year marked coins of 2-rupee design had made their appearance. The mintage year 2007 was short-lived and a new design of 2-rupee coin was released with 2007 as mintage year.

The story of 5 rupees and 10 rupees is even stranger. Professor Sinha designed both of these coins with bimetallic design. To issue bimetallic 5 rupees as replacement of copper nickel 5 rupees, again facing melting, it floated global tenders and imported blanks. Before they could issue the same, it had become overpriced and hence dropped the idea. It was then decided to issue 5 rupees in stainless steel like the 2 rupee coin but the design crisis of 2 rupees coin made it adopt wait and see policy.

10-rupee coin was another story. Since it as a denomination, which was being coinised for the first time, the issue could be more critical and hence got delayed.  Now it may not come in 2007. 50 paise were never minted and not likely either.

So the series, designed with many deliberations has already seen it first casualty. The 2-rupee coin, issued in 2005 (see images WithdrawnObverse#326 and WithdrawnReverse#326) has its replacement issued in 2007 (see images RevisedObverse and RevisedReverse). A short lived series indeed.
An unidentified coin is a piece of metal. An identified coin is a piece of history.

Rangnath

This coin story has more twists and turns than a John Le Carre novel!
The two coin designs depicted remind me more of Scandanavia and Winston Churchill than India. As Inidan designs, I'm not sorry to see them go.

richie

bart

I received those withdrawn and new Indian coins today.
The withdrawn 2 rupees exist in 2 varieties (or perhaps more, future will tell): with large and small date.
Looking at those coins gives quality control a new dimension: it is incredible how weakly struck they are. I received some examples of the Bombay, Calcutta and Hyderabad Mint (15 in total for the withdrawn 2 rupees) and only 1 of these coins (from Bombay) has been struck neatly with the whole design readable.

bart

bart

And here are the withdrawn 1 rupee and the new 2 rupees.

bart

Rangnath

I enjoyed your post Bart. Thanks.
One can expect both fine craftsmanship and bureaucratic incompetence from India.  If I were from India, I would be outraged at the mint failures. I would want my countries coinage to be admired internationally.
richie

bart

Well Richie,  I am quite sensitive to bad quality, as the Belgian Royal Mint is an example of bad quality control. On many Belgian eurocoins you can see die cracks. I also have some FDC-2 eurocoins of 2005 (Albert II and Henri of Luxemburg). It's good those coins are packed in a separate folder, because you would never believe they are FDC (or BU).

But comparing to those Unc. Indian coins, Belgian coins are beauties of high-standing quality! You can really see quality was not important in minting the huge amounts of coins necessary for a big country like India.

Bart

Figleaf

#6
Good point, Rangnath. India is doing great lately in spite of its administration, even though it has loosened up quite a bit. I have some tokens of the Alipore and Bombay mint restaurants. They are well struck. In my mind, this proves that the mints in India are perfectly capable of striking good coins (as you say, there is a long tradition of fine craftsmanship in India), but somehow, they are not allowed to do it. I suspect it's regulations or management or both.

As one of my colleagues once put it a long time ago: in India, writing paper is brown, wrinkly and sucking up ink, while toilet paper is white, smooth and incapable of removing even the smallest drop of moisture :D

Peter
An unidentified coin is a piece of metal. An identified coin is a piece of history.

idiotghost

Quote from: bart on October 17, 2007, 08:00:15 PM
And here are the withdrawn 1 rupee and the new 2 rupees.

bart

Bumping up a very old thread. I'm perplexed looking at my collection, that the One Rupee coin above, I dont have it God knows why! Was this 1 Rupee coin very scarce in circulation? I have tonnes of Two Rupees coins of the 2005-07 period but not a single 1 rupee coin! I have 2, 10 Rupees Bimettalic coins as well! I had heard the Rupees 5 coin (2005-07) was scarce & I dont have it either! Was the 1 rupee & 5 Rupees of this series very difficult to get, whereas 2 rupees was in abundance? All these years I thought I had the 1 Rupee coin & I guess used it in change as well (or maybe I'm wrong, I used the 2 rupees coin thinking its 1 Rupee, as both had same designs!)

Pabitra

Are you talking of unity in diversity series or Mudra series?

Unity in diversity series is discussed in
http://www.worldofcoins.eu/forum/index.php/topic,30258.0.html

It had four coins and 50 paise was never issued.

Mudra series had only 50 p, 1 and 2R ( three coins).

The revival of the topic made me feel nostalgic.

idiotghost

Quote from: Pabitra on October 10, 2019, 06:37:03 PM
Are you talking of unity in diversity series or Mudra series?

Unity in diversity series is discussed in
http://www.worldofcoins.eu/forum/index.php/topic,30258.0.html

It had four coins and 50 paise was never issued.

Mudra series had only 50 p, 1 and 2R ( three coins).

The revival of the topic made me feel nostalgic.

Hi Pabitra

I'm talking about The cross design (Unity in Diversity) that series has been discontinued. I have the Rs 2 & Rs 10 only in the series. Rs 5 I knew was barely released or available in circulation! But what flummoxed me is the Re 1 was easily there in circulation & I dont have a single piece of it! I think I used it up in change knowing I have it in my album all these 10 years! And last week i was cataloging my album through Numista & the Re 1 Cross/Unity in Diversity coin wasnt there in my collection! I'm pretty sad that I dont have a regular circulation coin with me!

Thanks
Parth

dheer

This was struck from 2004 to 2006. Comes in both orientations. The 2004 is from Mumbai and rare. Only denomination in 2004. You should still get 2005 rs 1 occasionally in circulation.

The Rs 5 in this series is very rare and is only in year 2007.
http://coinsofrepublicindia.blogspot.in
A guide on Republic India Coins & Currencies

idiotghost

Whats the going rate amongst dealers for the Rs 5 coin now? I remember in last month's coin exhibition in Cuffe Parade, one guy was looking around to buy this coin & couldnt get it! Not sure if he could purchase it later or not!

I havent come across the Rupees 2 or 1 version in a long time in circulation! What price will dealers ask for the Rupee 1 version? I know any dealer you deal with in Mumbai, they will add Mumbai tax & atrocious rates on it! I remember in Ahmadabad during my MBA days, I use to buy from a guy outside Geeta Mandir & he was very reasonable!

Pabitra

The 5 Rupees was minted and issued only in Kolkata before the design was stopped.
According to Sainath Redappa, it is for 800 Rupees in unc.

Of all the places in India, I found Bangalore numismatists and dealers to be most knowledgable and reasonable.

If you can visit one of their 3 shows per year, you will be pleasantly surprised.

In case you wish to contact one of them, please PM me.

idiotghost

No plans to go to Bangalore as of now, maybe in jan next year for a meeting. Till then its gonna be only hunting/buying in Mumbai only unless somebody asks prices that of the moon!

idiotghost

Well I recently got three Re 1 cross coins (unity in diversity) in last 1 week, after going through coin boxes at 2 shopkeepers! Its strangely still rare & now I'm certain after getting the coin that I never had seen it in circulation earlier, nor spent it in change! It looks quiet different from the Rupees 2 Unity in diversity coin & cant be mistaken as the same! Now got the 1,2,10 in the series.

Has anyone able to get the Rs 5 unity in diversity coin in circulation by luck? Or rather dealers are the only last resort!