Author Topic: Bull & horseman coin: Ghorids of Bamiyan, Jalal-al-din Ali (1206-15AD)  (Read 286 times)

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Offline jkk

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I am not confident of its alignment. It calipers 14.76mm and weighs 3.15g. I would appreciate help identifying it, and some idea of its value (if any).

« Last Edit: June 10, 2019, 11:55:45 AM by THCoins »
Jonathan

Offline THCoins

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Re: small horseman coin (Afghan/Indian?)
« Reply #1 on: May 25, 2019, 10:04:57 AM »
Can imagine this is a bit more difficult to attribute fully.
Again this is a Jital, but a little later than the Ghaznavid one. This was issued under the Ghorids of Bamiyan, under the rule of Jalal-al-din Ali (1206-15AD).
On the bull's side the legend reads "Sri Mahamada Same" in Sharada script, that's a reference to the previous supreme Ghorid ruler Muhammad bin Sam. On the horse side the first part of the ruler's name is written in Arab on the backside of the horse.
You won't find this in the Jitals extract on Academia, because that does not show all the subtypes. But this is Tye#169.3.
There is not a big collector market for these, so financial value is not that high. As i focus on the Jital category i'd be prepared to pay around 30 Dollars for this one.

Below a very similar one, this is Tye#169.4.
« Last Edit: June 10, 2019, 11:56:12 AM by THCoins »

Offline jkk

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Re: small horseman coin (Afghan/Indian?)
« Reply #2 on: May 27, 2019, 10:02:59 PM »
Many thanks. Is it possible to obtain a longer version that shows all the subtypes?
Jonathan

Offline THCoins

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Re: small horseman coin (Afghan/Indian?)
« Reply #3 on: May 27, 2019, 10:29:27 PM »
Quote
Is it possible to obtain a longer version that shows all the subtypes?

Then you will have to purchase the original book. It has been out of print for quite some while, but second hand copies emerge at auctions once in a while or can be found through internet dealers.

Offline jkk

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Re: small horseman coin (Afghan/Indian?)
« Reply #4 on: May 27, 2019, 10:30:39 PM »
No problem. Jitals by Rob Tye?
Jonathan

Offline THCoins

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Re: small horseman coin (Afghan/Indian?)
« Reply #5 on: May 27, 2019, 10:34:23 PM »
Yes, though already from 1995, that is the best reference for this category to date.

Offline THCoins

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Re: small horseman coin (Afghan/Indian?)
« Reply #6 on: May 31, 2019, 09:07:18 AM »
Just been informed that there are still new copies of "Jitals" available from the author.
So if you want to aquire one you may contact him directly !

Offline jkk

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Re: small horseman coin (Afghan/Indian?)
« Reply #7 on: May 31, 2019, 03:32:51 PM »
Thank you! I am surprised some enterprising soul does not snap them up.

Right now I'm awaiting my loaner copy from the ANA Library (they will let me hang onto it for two months) while awaiting a secondary market copy from a private seller who is, well, charging the market rate. However, this private seller may fall through. If so, I'll check directly with Mr. Tye.

What I am now doing is getting as far as I can with what I have (Tye's type catalog). Many of mine are the same types, enough to make it easier but to require me to guard against familiarity bias. When my Tye comes, I can begin to nail down subtypes and perhaps figure out the 1/3 or so that I can't place. It will also be a chance to check all my work, including my earliest non-WoC identifications that I now trust a bit less. Those that I then still can't figure out, I'll post.

A number are Chingiz/Genghis Khan. The majority are bull/horseman, made a little tougher by the fact that I know not one character of circa 1200 CE Devanagari. (Maybe I just need to learn it.) One common type is an 'Ala-ud-din, found about ten of those so far. Another is what I call the four-dot bull. I see now how people align the bull side: the hump is always there, even in the most stylized variants, provided the centering isn't atrocious.
Jonathan

Offline THCoins

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Re: small horseman coin (Afghan/Indian?)
« Reply #8 on: May 31, 2019, 06:33:11 PM »
Good luck with your project !
Hope you will also post some nice specimen just to share, next to the ones you may have problems with attributing.
If you have the Tye numbers you can also check in the indexes whether your specimen resemble the once posted previously on WoC.
For example Here is the index of Ghorid and Khwarezmshah types.