Author Topic: Which mint cast this?  (Read 975 times)

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Offline Figleaf

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Which mint cast this?
« on: February 23, 2015, 04:19:34 PM »
On Zeno, they are identified without explanation and the latest catalogue listing varieties seems to be dated 1904. Hole is 11 x 11 mm (outside frame) both sides. In order to help id and because I don't know where to look I have made macro-pictures of the characters. Here is the whole coin and the side markings.

Peter
An unidentified coin is a piece of metal. An identified coin is a piece of history.

Offline Figleaf

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Re: Which mint cast this?
« Reply #1 on: February 23, 2015, 04:21:47 PM »
And here is the rest.

Peter
An unidentified coin is a piece of metal. An identified coin is a piece of history.

Offline constanius

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Re: Which mint cast this?
« Reply #2 on: February 23, 2015, 07:24:23 PM »
I believe it is  Tenpo Tsuho, 100 mon (1835-70), Honza Kokaku variety.  Cherry blossom stamps (sakura).

  http://www.omnicoin.com/viewcoin/975122 

This link should help you identify the mint but I think it is Honza, Kinza mint.
http://charm.ru/coins/jp/Tenpo%20Tsuho.htm 

Pat
« Last Edit: February 23, 2015, 09:20:33 PM by constanius »

Pat

Offline bgriff99

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Re: Which mint cast this?
« Reply #3 on: February 23, 2015, 10:23:58 PM »
This is a confusing item, and not my area but to help maybe...

The 1990 JNDA catalog lists 15 varieties.    I can exclude about half of them but still not get an exact match to any.   It does not show anything of the edge stamps.   The coin shown in the link is their #3, one of the least expensive kinds for the ordinary casting.   And most likely is the one you have.

When the charm.ru guide talks about "rims" it means the centerframe.   And by "wide rims" it means the thickness of the frame, not the overall size.   In the JNDA "chokaku" (long wall) shown, it is not rectangular, but thinner rimmed wider hole.   The several kinds with slight rectangularity have reference names for other characteristics of the writing, and are all rather scarcer.

"Kokaku" and "hirokaku" meaning thick rims are the same thing.   Maybe both words used in Japanese (?) or somebody used a dictionary to translate and picked the wrong form.   The "Honza" mint according to charm.ru applies to both Tokyo and Osaka (??).   JNDA shows three varieties: thin, medium and thick centerframe, but none have any rectangularity.    The square thick kind is attributed to Osaka at charm.ru, which matches the edge punch, and this coin.

Honza, Kinza mint requires a rectangular centerframe, which this coin does not have.    Now can somebody clarify if "Honza" means 'Japan seat', 'book gathering', or what? 

Offline Figleaf

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Re: Which mint cast this?
« Reply #4 on: February 23, 2015, 11:34:44 PM »
Using the Japanese version of Wikipedia in combination with the Zeno page Constanius linked to, I have been able to establish that my coin is probably Chukaku (square hole with 2 mm. rim.) That narrows the range to Fukuoka and Osaka. Looking at the shirushi, the best solution is Osaka, Honza mint, Keio 1 (1865)

There is a pretty good Japanese online dictionary here. It says Honza is a geographical or family name. It seems that it was used both for an area in Tokyo (situated in Asakusabashi) and for an area in Osaka (situated in Settsu).

Thank you for the help!

Peter
« Last Edit: February 23, 2015, 11:47:53 PM by Figleaf »
An unidentified coin is a piece of metal. An identified coin is a piece of history.