Author Topic: China, cash, Yuan dynasty...  (Read 2081 times)

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Offline Figleaf

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China, cash, Yuan dynasty...
« on: April 17, 2012, 02:07:25 AM »
Not identified on numismatique.com. Can we help?

Peter
« Last Edit: April 22, 2012, 04:12:37 PM by Figleaf »
An unidentified coin is a piece of metal. An identified coin is a piece of history.

akona20

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Re: Unidentified cash coin 4
« Reply #1 on: April 17, 2012, 06:11:17 AM »
Emperor Tai Zong Northern Song
« Last Edit: April 17, 2012, 02:18:57 PM by Figleaf »

Offline weepio

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Re: Unidentified cash coin 4
« Reply #2 on: April 21, 2012, 11:50:00 AM »
The coin reads Tian Tong Tong Bao.

Maybe a Vietnamese coin? I'm not sure, can't find it in my Chinese books yet, still in progress.

akona20

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Re: Unidentified cash coin 4
« Reply #3 on: April 21, 2012, 12:31:59 PM »
Hmm Weepio thank goodness you are here looking at these.

I will look again tomorrow.

(At least I got close with my reading, lol)

Offline Figleaf

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Re: Unidentified cash coin 4
« Reply #4 on: April 21, 2012, 04:03:52 PM »
Vietnamese and three of the four characters correct.

Peter
An unidentified coin is a piece of metal. An identified coin is a piece of history.

Offline weepio

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Re: Unidentified cash coin 4
« Reply #5 on: April 22, 2012, 03:28:01 PM »
Found the coin under the section Yuan Dynastie, no value set so extremely rare.

Offline Figleaf

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Re: Unidentified cash coin 4
« Reply #6 on: April 22, 2012, 03:54:18 PM »
Would that 1363 date not mean emperor Shun Ti, era Zhìzhèng (至正) Does the text explain why the characters are so different? To my untrained eye, the first character has more in common with Tiānlì (天曆)?

Peter
An unidentified coin is a piece of metal. An identified coin is a piece of history.

Offline bgriff99

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Re: China, cash, Yuan dynasty...
« Reply #7 on: September 29, 2014, 10:40:00 AM »
Peter, the inscription belongs to an obscure "Yuan rebel".   There is one ordinary script and one seal script version recognized, both regular cash size.    The calligraphy of yours doesn't match, but is comparable, and its size is of a value two.   Other Yuan rebel coins of that period come in value 1-2-3, and are rare and often forged.   This is a fantasy coin.

Weepio showed a page from the modern book series Zhongguo Guqian Daji.   Its same two coins are shown in Ding Fubao, published in 1940, which also does not give prices for them.   The newer book even had to use Ding's rubbing of the seal script coin.   Part of "value not set" means nobody knows for sure what is real with this one.

Offline Figleaf

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Re: China, cash, Yuan dynasty...
« Reply #8 on: September 29, 2014, 12:58:33 PM »
Breakthrough. I found a modern copy on the net. It is identified as:

Replica Tian You Tong Bao 10 cash coin cast by Yuan Dynasty rebel ZHANG Shi Cheng (1353-1357 AD) in his 'Tian You' years. S-1126.

I presume S = Schjöth? Wouldn't that fit the bill?

Peter
An unidentified coin is a piece of metal. An identified coin is a piece of history.

Offline bgriff99

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Re: China, cash, Yuan dynasty...
« Reply #9 on: September 29, 2014, 08:59:12 PM »
This is a different bottom character, and a different Ming rebel.   It's virtually a perfect copy, for calligraphy and appearance.   It exists as a value 1, 2, 3 and 5 all with a numeral on the reverse.

Offline Figleaf

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Re: China, cash, Yuan dynasty...
« Reply #10 on: September 29, 2014, 10:27:32 PM »
You're right. Enthusiasm taking over from careful checking in two windows side by side :-[

Peter
An unidentified coin is a piece of metal. An identified coin is a piece of history.